Help Please! Apple wine not clearing

[Closet Brewer]

Hello all. I've been reading this forum for a while: it was Hazel's parsnip wine that encouraged me to start brewing again! This is my first post, though.

I've made a fair bit of wine from whatever comes to hand, and the only problem I've had is with apple wine - the stuff just won't clear! I made some in sept '11 and sept '12 and both refuse to move on from their current state of resembling ditch water.

I've tried: Time (over a year for the 2011 one), degassing, finings (a 2 stage chitin based one, and bentonite) and temperature variation (cold outhouse, warm living room and everything inbetween).

I even tried eggshells. Now I have cloudy wine with eggshells floating in it.

I used good amounts of pectolase and amylase in the initial must of both so I don't think it's pectin or starch.

Bentonite has been the most succesful thus far, causing a fresh deposit of fluffy sediment, but the remaining wine is still cloudy. We're not even talking a slight haze here, you can't see through the bugger!

I followed CJJs recipe with 20lbs-odd of windfalls on both occasions.

So, O gurus of the yeast and the fruit, any suggestions on what to try next?

[Samurailord]

Hi CB

If you have already tried Bentonite and finings then I am at a bit of a loss as to what to suggest.

Have you tried the wine?

Apart from the cloudiness does it taste OK?

If it is OK tasting and worth saving I might give a last ditch attempt at clearing a go with some powdered charcoal, which will turn the entire demi john black as night, but will settle out over 48 hours and should take any of the solids still in suspension with it.

If that doesn't work, you may have to put up with a nice tasting but cloudy wine.

Andy

[Samurailord]

Oh, and welcome to the Vine

[alldigging]

I'd be having a taste.

So whats the difference between apple wine and cider?

[Samurailord]

So whats the difference between apple wine and cider?

Apple Cider is made from 100% juice and pulp of apples with no added sugar (and sometimes not even yeast added as the natural yeasts on the fruit will start off the fermentation) whereas Apple Wine has added sugar, water and yeast.

Andy

[Hazel at the Hill]

Hi CB - welcome to the Vine.

My first thought was a pectin haze, but you have that covered - what would happen if you put it through a coffee filter? At least it would get the egg shell out!

[alldigging]

Apple Cider is made from 100% juice and pulp of apples with no added sugar (and sometimes not even yeast added as the natural yeasts on the fruit will start off the fermentation) whereas Apple Wine has added sugar, water and yeast.

Andy

Ah ok
Thanks Andy

[redser]

You could try pectolaise again (perhaps there wasn't enough in the primary) and leave it somewhere cold to help it settle out, the fridge might help.
Failing that just drink it in a frosty glass

[Closet Brewer]

Thanks team! A few ideas to be getting on with.

Samurailord, I hadn't considered charcoal. I remember using it years ago when I went through a 'prohibition' kit phase. I might try it in one of the demijohns but I'd be afraid it woud take a lot of the flavour out with it? In answer to your other question, it smells and tastes delicious!

Hazel, I tried coffee filters a little while ago on some blackberry wine: it was one of my first and I'd bottled it too soon. There was loads of sediment in the bottles so I tried the filters. They didn't work for me then, but I will need some way of getting those blasted eggshells out!

Perhaps it wouldn't be a disaster to leave it cloudy, but it would hurt my pride... Does anyone else have this problem with apple wine, or is it just me? I'm getting a bit of a complex about it!

[rustylady]

Hazel, I tried coffee filters a little while ago on some blackberry wine: it was one of my first and I'd bottled it too soon. There was loads of sediment in the bottles so I tried the filters. They didn't work for me then, but I will need some way of getting those blasted eggshells out!

To remove the eggshells strain your wine through a jelly bag or muslin. That should do it.

[Hazel at the Hill]

Perhaps it wouldn't be a disaster to leave it cloudy, but it would hurt my pride

As it would mine.

... Does anyone else have this problem with apple wine, or is it just me? I'm getting a bit of a complex about it!

I had a massive problem the first time I made apple wine - it look like it had fluffy clouds in it - but once I'd sussed that I hadn't added (enough) pectolase and bunged some in and given it a shake it cleared in about a day. This pic shows the crystal clear above and the fluffy clouds below as it was clearing.


I don't think that this is your problem, though.

I have the same problem - if it is any comfort - with quince wine. It's been sitting looking murky for about 14 months now. It's really sweet, and I was going to blend it with some v dry (crystal clear) blackcurrant/rhubarb but I don't want to end up with a murky mixture that I can't get to clear.

[SarzWix]

I would give the pectolase another go myself

[Two_Sheds]

So whats the difference between apple wine and cider?

about 9% no my message is not too short

[Alison]

about 9% no my message is not too short

Lol although you obvioulsy haven't had any of the cider OH made last year, just crushed apple juice, no sugar or added yeast and it fermented to a very strong brew which had some very amusing consequences

[Closet Brewer]

I don't think it's pectin, but I came here to ask for your help and it would be rude to ignore it. The majority call for more pectolase, so more pectolase I shall try!

While I'm embarrassed to expose my haze to the nation, I thought a picture might help.



There's a bottle of last november's parsnip and apple on the left, both as a control and to prove I'm not completely incompetent The deposit in the apple wine is from the bentonite added a couple of weeks back.

So... I'll rack it today, add the pectolase (and get the eggshells out of the other demijohn...) and post another piccie in a week or so! The current Mrs Brewer is at work, so I can make a mess in the kitchen without fear of castigation...