Anyone any good with employment contracts?

[Shortie]

I'm already guessing there isn't much hope in getting far with this but still....

Mr Shortie and his best mate started working for a friend 2 weeks ago. Contracts signed etc.

Now he lead them to believe he was buying an established (but small) business from someone. I turns out it's a new business, and there has been tonnes of messing around (like the fact it's a driving job and he still doesn't have the cars, or that he never turns up when he says he'll meet them.) It's come to a crunch when today neither of them got paid as promised. The guy is apparently down at the bank now finding out what is happening.

I'm guessing that unless miracles happen today they're both walking away. I've told them not to do anything until we know the 'proper way' of handling this. Any one know what they're entitled to (if anything?)

Ta

[Shortie]

Hmmm... just spoken to Mr Shortie and it would appear they are being 'paid off' with a cheque. I'm guessing it will bounce

[Steve(spt)]

You need some proper advice, go and see your local CAB ASAP.

[bobleponge]

Hurrumphheedd for CAB. My daughters father in law works in one and he is brilliant at these things. Good luck

[dexterdoglancashire]

Sorry to hear about this Shortie! Its always a bugger when things turn out like this. I'm not sure on the legal front, but methinks that if something looks like its too good to be true, then dont go for it. The only thing I can thinkg of is the CAB, at least they may be able to point you in the right direction. I do hope that you havent given them £ in advance. Good luck. Bernie

[Shortie]

Hiya

No, no cash invested. None was asked for, but I stipulated that to Mr Shortie when he was going to meet the chap.

The guy has retracted what he said earlier (he basically listen to his flatmate about something when he didn't hear both sides of the story first) and *apparently* the pay problems were because he didn't realise it took a certain number of days to get BACS payments set up

He's got the benefit of the doubt until Monday when they payment should be in (BACS was submitted last Tuesday I think) and I've offered to help him with the admin of the company as in hindsight we've realised he's just really struggling to juggle everything himself.

Okay, I've not got all the time in the world myself (2 young'ns and back to work now) but if it means it will keep them all afloat I'll do what it takes. If this venture does take off it'll be really good... God I'm a glutton for punishment

[dexterdoglancashire]

Shortie - having taken the lunge short of recently I wish you both all the best for the future - youve got your heads screwed on, so you wont be taken for a ride. just be careful! Bernie

[Shortie]

Ta

I just felt so desperate earlier

[NOG]

If the BACS was sent on Tuesday it will be in your account now. If you have telephone banking give them a call and should be able to see it in the Clearing. They can see it coming but not let you draw on it. It may put your mind at rest that it is there.

BACS is a bit of a Banking con.....the money goes out of my account on the tuesday night and in to the Clearing...I stop getting the interest on it....then it floats about...till friday when it turns up in your account and you get the interest on it. But the Clearing gets the interest on it on the Wed and Thrus..and they charge me a fee for ssetting it up and I have to do most of the work.....

[bubblewrap]

Hi Shortie is your other half a member of a Trade Union?
If so the unions legal department will be able to help!
or as others have pointed out the CAB.
Here is a site that might help!
Employment contracts and conditions : Directgov - Employment

[Shortie]

Thanks BW

I'm still not ruling out "problems" so still up for reading up on their rights

No idea about the Trade Union, though I doubt it. Mr Shortie has been snoring on the sofa for an hour so my chances of stirring him now are slim to none

[Paul Wagland]

Hi Shortie, is the problem basically that your OH and his mate have done some work and are now not being paid?

If it's that simple I can thoroughly recommend the small claims court. I've used it three times and its quick, easy and effective. All you need to do is log on to www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/ and fill in some basic personal details, then download the claim form. Fill this in with a brief description of what happened (it's only one page), then make a photocopy and send it to the non-paying person along with a letter saying you will submit the form if they don't pay within seven days.

Most people pay up faster than you can say 'thieving sh!t', and if they don't you just pay £35 (ish) to submit the claim. If the other guy can't defend his position to the court (and he probably won't even try) then he has to pay both what he owes you and all the court fees, or face fines, bailiffs, CCJs etc. Very persuasive!

[Paulottie]

Good Info Paul. But I would hope it hasn't come to that yet.

You really have to ask yourself if this is likely to work out Shortie. You are right to be reasonable and positive and offer him a hand up if he is struggling if he is just starting out cashflow will be difficult. If he is a friend, you must know the other people he has had dealings with in the past? Usually a rogue has a history and your feminine intuition should tell you if he is genuine too. If he's a decent guy he will remember you helped when he had nothing, A waged job is often a week in hand, and then you are paid for the second week within a week from submitting your hours. so three weeks is not unusual.


Different, I know, but when I used to work on the sites I would always ask other Sub-contractors if they had been paid ok. But then they have 28 days to pay as a rule. My personal limit was 2 weeks work on spec for private clients and labour only arrangements or 2 weeks late with payment for companies and then I downed tools. But that always ups the anti and makes people awkward. I have only failed to be paid for 2 weeks in 20 years. I just move on -quicker and less stressful to find another income than arque, BUT never upset a chippy, a rat or piece of fish boxed in under the bath or floor leaves a nice reminder when your gone....Another traditional one was to put a nail in the galvanised water tank in the loft that would cause a very disruptive leak a year or two later.(they are plastic these days)... like the chef spitting in your soup if you upset him

[SarzWix]

Shortie, this sounds like a similar scenario to one my OH got us into a few years ago - a mate was setting up a business, it was going to be marvellous & he wanted his mates to share in the lucre... Unfortunately, he was a rubbish businessman (although great at sales) and what ensued was a year of complete nightmares, never getting paid the right amount on the right day, culminating in a period over Christmas where we had £80 to last 2 weeks From about a month into the venture I was sure that the bloke was useless with money, but OH wouldn't hear a word against him to begin with... We very nearly ended up divorced over it.
Be careful, be very, very careful.

[Shortie]

Thanks for the link Paul, I feel worse for our friends right now as they only have one income, and we have my wages and (thankfully) money left from a recent Equity release (which I'll used to bail our other friends out of the sh*t if needs be too, I won't see them go without).

The score is that they've not managed to DO any work for him yet as he never turns up to see them to discuss what they need to do etc, etc. But they have signed contracts with start dates etc.

I've been trying to suss the guy out and I don't know if I can suss him or not. He says he needs help and will call, but doesn't ?? I think he's a poor business man who doesn't easily accept help, but how do you help someone like that? It remains to be seen if they get paid tomorrow. I'd almost bet my car on the fact they won't but I always look for a person's better nature so you never know eh? If they don't get paid then they're both going to go our local CAB and Mr Shortie can walk straight into agency work for now with his HGV licence, he checked on Friday and there is plenty of work for him. I checked with ACAS on Friday too and becuase they've been in the contract less than a month either side can terminate their contracts with no notice as there is nothing specific in them to say they need to give x amount of notice from day one.