The "sack 'em" culture

[HeyWayne]

LadyWayne and I were having this discussion this morning following a report on the news about the call for the CEO of BA to be sacked over the T5 debacle.

We're both in agreement that we're fed up with this culture of people being sacked when things go wrong. You know how it is - someone's employed to do a job up high, they mess around with things for a couple of years, things don't work out great, they make a bit of a mess and they're sacked. Someone else comes in for a couple of years... and so the cycle continues.

Do you think that our economy would be better served if people were made to stick around and clear up the mess they make rather then just being shifted on to the next poor organisation to suffer the same fate?

[janeyo]

I'd just quite like to see people being able do actually do the job they are paid for instead of the 50/50 rule that we seem to have nowadays. This phrase was coined by my OH and seems to work in all industries, trades and well everywhere really.

50% of people are good at what they do and 50% are rubbish.

Just his (and more and more often these days) my opinion too!

janeyo

[SueA]

I think it depends on how & why they are sacked Wayne, sometimes they end up getting a handsome payoff which is totally wrong & I do think other companies should take notice of the mess they've made & not employ them in another high profile job which they can then cock up all over again but they don't seem to learn. Good job some of these people don't run companies in Japan, you occasionally hear of people over there who have caused some disaster or financial ruin by their actions & feel so disgraced that they take their own lives, over here thay seem to say O.K. I'll hold my hands up & take the blame if you pay me x millions to go!
I do agree though that there seems to be a sort of 'blame culture' aspect to it in that rather than trying to put things right companies try to look like they're doing something by 'culling' someone.

[smallblueplanet]

Lol! Why should people who are rubbish at their job be allowed to stay in it to try to put it right!?

What 'sack 'em' culture - its nigh-on impossible to get rid of people because they're crap. You have to allow them access to training, to give them opportunity to be able to do the job they were hired to do. Then if they still can't do it you have to find them a job they can do. HR rules!

[HeyWayne]

Lol! Why should people who are rubbish at their job be allowed to stay in it to try to put it right!?

I should have known someone as perfect as you would not understand!

If one always does things right how does one learn what's wrong?

[jackie j]

I dont think people in high places should get the sack as some of you say let them clear up the mess first and no big pay off. Most of the time its the little people that get the sack cos they take the rap.
Our manager wont employ more staff or allow overtime cos it comes out of his bonus but its us that customers moan at when the queues are long or their is nothing on the shelves.

[kirsty b]

I heard some chap from BA (think he was fairly high-up) on the radio today saying that he had been offered a big bonus but he refused it as he thought it was inappropriate following the T5 fiasco. How many others would have said no do you think?

[smallblueplanet]

If one always does things right how does one learn what's wrong?

Some people are just no good at their job. Of course if you can't see that...

[HeyWayne]

I understand perfectly, perhaps you've never had to work with someone who shouldn't be doing a job (for whatever reason)? Or perhaps thats because you're too 'close' to that person?



Some people are just no good at their job. Of course if you can't see that...

I've worked with plenty of people who were unsuited at their job, but as you pointed out yourself, they can often be retrained to do other tasks. Everyone has a talent - even though it may not be immediately obvious Doesn't mean they should be sacked because they can't do a particular job - one could argue that the employer got it wrong when giving them the job in the first place.

I agree, some people are just no good at their job, but sometimes people need to look at the bigger picture...

[smallblueplanet]

I agree, some people are just no good at their job, but sometimes people need to look at the bigger picture...

So you pay people lots of money to do a job, they can't do it. They mess it up for everyone else, they make others jobs harder. They make others work lives miserable. So you retrain the person who can't do their job (no-one else gets that amount of training), they still can't do their job. You look for another job that they can do - you move them sideways on the same money. This has taken time, meanwhile staff fed up with working with incompetant colleagues have left their jobs...

do you mean that bigger picture?

What 'sacking culture'!

[HeyWayne]

So you pay people lots of money to do a job, they can't do it. They mess it up for everyone else, they make others jobs harder. They make others work lives miserable. So you retrain the person who can't do their job (no-one else gets that amount of training), they still can't do their job. You look for another job that they can do - you move them sideways on the same money. This has taken time, meanwhile staff fed up with working with incompetant colleagues have left their jobs...

do you mean that bigger picture?

What 'sacking culture'!

So bringing in someone completely new is the answer?

and then the next time

and the next

and the next

The bigger picture I was referring to was what we know in the trade as "outside influences" - things beyond one's control.

[zazen999]

I'm in the training consultancy game so the more people that need training the better!

I'm all for more stringent recruitment processes; some people are in the wrong jobs from the start and nobody has the balls to tell them. It's not their fault; it's the management's for recruiting them in the first place. Manage them up or manage them out...

[smallblueplanet]

So bringing in someone completely new is the answer?

and then the next time

and the next

and the next...

No - difficult as it may be for someone 'in the trade' to understand - recruit the right people to begin with.

Again, what 'sacking culture'?

[zanussi101]

I heard some chap from BA (think he was fairly high-up) on the radio today saying that he had been offered a big bonus but he refused it as he thought it was inappropriate following the T5 fiasco. How many others would have said no do you think?

I think that's a great point. But I think more importantly we should ask why he was offered the bonus in the first place. I know BA made huge profits in the period running up the T5 opening but surely the shareholders (or whoever it is that decide on who to offer bonuses to) should've seen the massive cock-up that was T5 and realised that the bonus was inappropriate for themselves.

We live in such a target driven society now and i think it's time that companies woke up to the fact that there are other issues which are as, if not more, important.

[HeyWayne]

No - difficult as it may be for someone 'in the trade' to understand - recruit the right people to begin with.

Again, what 'sacking culture'?

And you can guarantee they're the right people how? So you've always recruited the right people for the job first time? Lucky you.

I believe I said "sack 'em" culture - and I was referring to the seemingly increasing number of high powered individuals who are "encouraged" to stand down almost immediately after things turn a little sour - politicians included.