Organic Bananas

[chris]

I'm often baffled by this. Organic, to me, unless I've got the wrong end of the stick is growing without chemicals/pesticides/etc producing a much tastier crop, yada yada yada....

However, really, I don't think it's just about that. It's also about the impact upon the environment. Organic veg/fruit when bought from your local supplier/farm/shop generally won't have as many food miles as your average supermarket alternatives would be.. Yet, I constantly see (espeically) organic (actually, fair trade ones too) bananas wrapped in plastic packaging, where as your other standard varieties of bananas are just freely hanging out, chilling loose in boxes ready to be rummaged through and taken off to their new home.

Why?

Why can't they just be sold in cardboard boxes, with stickers put on them so the checkout peeps can see that their organic? I don't think (though, I could be guilt of this in the past in my younger years ) people would change the stickers? The difference in price isn't that great anyway?

K, enough from me - perhaps having a casual beer and then pondering isn't something I should do often

[snohare]

I can tell you why non-organic bananas are not wrapped in plastic bags. That's because bananas are cloned and extremely vulnerable to pests, which means that the mainland plantations (as opposed to the islands where the organic ones are grown, sans pests/diseases) have to dose the crop with very nasty chemicals. Because there was such high levels of poisoning amongst the plantation workers who could not wear protective gear in the heat and humidity, the producers ended up impregnating blue plastic bags with the organophosphates etc and simply having them tied over the bunches as they hung on the plant. The chemicals released gradually, and (hopefully) poisoning rates dropped.
To save confusion and accidental poisoning of customers, the bags are removed from the crop as it is harvested, and not replaced by other plastic bags. (Don't ask what they do with the old bags, you don't want to know.)
Conventionally grown bananas vastly outnumber both fairtrade and organic bananas in terms of sales, although fairtrade is improving. Organic bananas on the other hand, like fairtrade, need to be heavily marketed and look "extra value" merchandise before the supermarkets will devote space to them; to supermarkets, it is all about sales/profit per shelf foot, and hence the sales must be maximised. Basic human nature dictates that shiny labels on plastic bags will help sell the "added value" to those who would be otherwise indecisive; tatty cardboard boxes full of bananas with a tiny slightly different little sticker will not.
There is another factor which is extremely important, which no doubt plays a major part in making the labels so large on the bags. Traceability is a major concern with organic foods, as there is lots of scope for extremely profitable commercial fraud. So each product tends to be individually certified by an organic certification scheme, using code numbers to ensure that there is no chance of fraud, and with the name of the certifying authority prominent to help convince producers that they are joining a well-known brand identity when they shell out for certification.
They can't stick the large labels on the bananas because the banana skins need to breathe - that's why the stickers are so tiny.

[Two_Sheds]

all of Sainsbury's bananas are Fairtrade, so plastic bags aren't necessary (to differentiate)


PS. if you want to make a point about over-packaging, leave it at the checkout, or stuff it in one of the shop's own bins

[chris]

I didn't know that, *** hell !

Makes me wonder what else I'm eating... actually eating!!

I've heard that produce can be labelled, when only 5% of it's ingredients can be organic (i.e. a min of 5% ingreidents are organic) ?

[Two_Sheds]

I've heard that produce can be labelled, when only 5% of it's ingredients can be organic

No, I don't think so.
Find out more about organic certification

[Hilary B]

If you buy a fruit tree of a named variety, it is cloned. Taking cuttings is a form of cloning.
There is a technique for propagating which is a bit closer to what most people think of as cloning (can't remember the name, micro-somethingorother), but in terms of health drawbacks, taking cuttings or grafting are little different (grafting can bring in extra strength from the rootstock, cuttings don't have that modification).

[smallblueplanet]

Fascinating, if gloomy article here

Conservation Magazine Blog Archive The Sterile Banana

[northepaul]

Thats is a very interesting thread, thank you for sharing and debating. I have learned a lot about organic food, and had my eyes opened a fair bit from the vine. Thank you

Out of interest with regards Sainsburys:
They had shelves full of cage hen eggs a couple of weeks ago,when all the snow was around, even though they pledged they would only buy free range....
It just goes to show that good intentions are literally that....intentions! But when profit is at stake, they drop their so called 'principles' at the drop of a hat.

[chris]

Did you watch that programme - Jamie Oliver presented? About what they do with male chicks (basically, gas them) - and all about battery chickens, the processed meat (bones put through a press, to get every last drop of "meat" out of it - then made into stuff like twislers, etc). It's on youtube in parts, *** gross!

Some people in the live audience were still saying they'd buy battery eggs, as they can't afford it.

Perhaps if they gave up smoking, they could?

Also, the HFW one, about protien and omega 3 levels in chicken.. from battery, barn, and then organic - the results were shocking! Battery / Cheapo chicken breasts were actually worse for you to eat, due to the levels of fat, and lack of protien/omega3.... real eye opener.. I mean we've always, even as student tried to buy the best produce we can - people/friends often scoff at us as we do spend a lot on good quality food.. people say they can't afford it, but really, we can't afford to eat sh*te food!

[Two_Sheds]

Out of interest with regards Sainsburys:
They had shelves full of cage hen eggs a couple of weeks ago...even though they pledged they would only buy free range...

I hope you've written to them and expressed your disgust

[northepaul]

I hope you've written to them and expressed your disgust

No, I cant because OH works for them!! However it does give me inside information about their so called 'ethical' practices.

[Two_Sheds]

You can be Miss Ann Onymous though

[Flummery]

For another reason I wish they wouldn't sell Fair Trade nanas in poly bags. There are just 2 of us. I don't like nanas much. There are too many in a bag. If I could pick a few or a small bunch I would. At present, I buy the Fair Trade ones and end up making banana cake with the brown ones!

[northepaul]

Just had a look at the form, you have to fill out name addy and email as a Mandatory field before you can continue....

[Two_Sheds]

Just had a look at the form, you have to fill out name addy and email as a Mandatory field before you can continue....

free hotmail account in a pseudonym, used just for complaints?