Vegetarianism

[Florence Fennel]

I have enjoyed reading this very interesting thread so my two pen'orth is quite short. I prefer veg, but Himself prefers meat and says because he is old enough, he can refuse to eat veg. I think I could probably live without most kinds of meat, except perhaps the bacon sandwich. Confused? So am I. It's going to make me think some more, so thank you very much.

[Two_Sheds]

Can any of you 'experienced' Veggies point us in the direction of a Veggie-cooks Bible of any sort?

There was a Rose Elliot that I loved, but is now out of print (I can't remember the title: my copy was left in the train station bin at Worthing, because I couldn't carry all of my belongings in my one suitcase when I moved back to Norfolk )

I don't use a cook book for myself, I just take whatever's ready on the lotty, and either stir fry, soup, curry or salad it. Not v.helpful, sorry

[smallblueplanet]

There was a Rose Elliot that I loved, but is now out of print (I can't remember the title:...

Lots of Rose Elliot cheap on ebay

rose elliot | eBay

[its hilly]

My favourite veggie cookbook is 'Not just a load of old lentils' by Rose Elliot. Not that one was it TS? Mostly cos it was the first one I tried recipes from. I've also got one i enjoy called 'The vegetarian year' but no idea who it's by as it's still living in a box.
Having spent most of my life as a pub chef I tend to experiment rather than recipe. Used to try to make sure there were always several vegetarian choices on the menu. Which made us very popular Sometimes it was only a case of making a meal without meat and then taking half and adding meat. Other times it was a full vegetarian recipe. At home I often do things like chilli without meat, also pasta goes really well with veggie sauces. And soup is always made with vegetable stock, unless it's meat based. You would be shocked at how many chefs will use chicken stock to make 'vegetable' soup.
Last nights tea was crisp jacket potatoes, with vegetable omelete. Mmmmm.

[Rocketron]

Much as we love our veg I must confess I would realy miss my meat and cant envisage anything that would make me give it up voluntarly

That's the key.
When I met my wife I had to think how to cook her a meal.
I was so used to seeing a plate where the meat is "here", the potatoes are "here" and the other veg are "here".
It dawned on me how to overcome this problem. Spaghetti Bolognese, Curries, Chinese, Stews, Pies, didn't have the same separation on the plate.
I can now cook all of these (nearly as good as my wife) and don't miss the meat.

[baldrick]

I like this thread, despite being a meat-eater. I have expressed an interest in vegetarian food before, on here, but was accused of being patronising, which I definitely wasn't trying to be. Can any of you 'experienced' Veggies point us in the direction of a Veggie-cooks Bible of any sort? With the winter months approaching, my gardening work will tail right off at times, and I will be able to spend more time in the kitchen, so I may as well put my time to good use, and I would like to be able to surprise Mr.G with something creative. Thanks in advance.

The single vegan is an excellent book full of ideas.
I was veggie for many many years until I suddenly (and it really was sudden) woke up one day and thought "hang on, Im veggie coz I hate factory farming.....but if everyone who cares about animals was veggie, the only meat it would be cost effective to produce is factory farmed, coz if you dont care you wont care what you buy, and if you do care you wouldnt buy at all..." I carried on, but then realised its the NON MEAT side of animal based foor production thats probably the most wasteful of life. Day old egg laying chicks are killed. Caves are surplus to the milk industry so tiny babies are killed. They used to be sent abroad to veal crates which is probably worse I admit. I kind of gradually slipped into meat eating. I would vastly prefer to eat a chicken of a dual purpose breed who has had some sort of life prior to slaughter than an egg from a commercial egg farm...even a free range one, because the male chicks will still have been killed at a day old rather than getting 6 months or so of life. I have eaten rabbits that have been shot as pests to crops, and will always be shot as pests to crops whether they are eaten or not. I gradually came to the conclusion that actually the way to go was vegan as lacto vegetarianism does not stop the killing, it just makes you feel like you are not participating in the killing. Unfortunately eating vegetables only does not stop the killing either, it just puts you a bit further away from it. Veggie plant eating pests of all sorts from slugs to rabbits will always die so we can eat whether we use their flesh or not, whether we are veggie, vegan or not. The other thing is terrain. It is correct that putting human food into an animal to produce a different human food is wasteful. In many upland areas where nothing much grows at all we graze sheep for food. They eat grass and plants we dont. Not eating those sheep would not increase production of our food. If we did somehow find a way of cultivating our wild uplands much of our native plant and animal life would disappear with the sheep. Its a very thought provoking subject, and one I struggled with for a long time.
I am now of the opinion we need to weave plant and animal food production together. Grow without chemicals as far as possible. Use animals in the rotation of crops. Raise chickens for eggs and meat, and grow on male calves for humanely raised veal. Eat rabbits instead of shooting and dumping them. Let everything connect where you can. Its only my opinion, but its one ive agonised over and Im now at peace with. Good topic of discussion snadger! x

[Potstubsdustbins]

Baldrick, your reply was most thought provoking and very correct. Now you mention it there must be very very few food stuffs produced that do not involve the death of an animal/bird at some stage in the process.

Colin

[Snadger]

Very thought provoking.

The way I see it is mankind started as hunter/gatherers because we needed to, to get the nutrients to survive? We also used the animal pelts to keep warm.
We then moved on to farming of both the animals we hunted and the fruit/veg we gathered................ also for our expanding population to survive. We used the animal manure to help grow our crops.
Technology then moved on so fast that we (in this country anyway) no longer needed pelts to keep warm as man made fibres had been developed. We can farm enough of both meat and veg which will quite easily feed our population.
We don't all now need to eat meat to survive and we no longer rely on animal manure to grow our crops.
The areas that wouldn't grow crops and are only suitable for animal husbandry could be used for the extra housing of our rapidly expanding population.
The land is not finite though and a given area of land will only clothe and feed a given number of inhabitants.
Do we really want to live in a world without animals.........even if they are farmed? Do we really want to be crammed on to this small Island like sardines.
Maybe the way ahead is to make the areas we grow crops on, also our recreational land in some way?
I have respect for all life and I believe we are an animal with an enlarged brain who should look after our fellow animals.
I do think that becoming a vegetarian is the 'right' thing to do but.......................

[Two_Sheds]

the NON MEAT side of animal based foor production thats probably the most wasteful of life. Day old egg laying chicks are killed. [male] Caves [sic] are surplus to the milk industry so ... are killed.

True, true

I have eaten rabbits that have been shot as pests to crops, and will always be shot as pests to crops whether they are eaten or not.

They don't need to be shot/killed though. Small-scale gardeners like us can fence them out

Unfortunately eating vegetables only does not stop the killing either...slugs to rabbits will always die

I don't have a problem with killing slugs. Eating them though ... gack

[Two_Sheds]

Do we really want to live in a world without animals.........even if they are farmed?

Why do you think animals would disappear if everyone was vegetarian?
There'd still be wild animals, just as before. There just wouldn't be farmed animals - sheep & ponies (and potentially cows?) could roam free in the moorlands like they always have, down on Dartmoor for example

[Patchninja]

I bought this book a few years ago
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mediterrane...0&sr=1-2-spell
and it's so good that I got my daughter a copy - she's a vegetarian, and the recipes are wonderful. She takes traditional recipes and adapts them and the flavours are so good you can feel the sunshine on your skin!

[baldrick]

Snadge just go veggie without being puritan about it......for example if you want to carry on eating eggs you may as well breed your own hens and give surplus cockerels a life before they are rehomed...or killed. If they are killed eat them or give them away to someone who would normally buy a factory farmed bird. Its not an attitude which sits well with militant veggies, but you will have no more blood on your hands that you would have buying free range eggs..............I dont know what happened to my laying hens male siblings...but I have a fair idea :-(. As human beings we will always have to be hypocrites or rigid unflexible fools. Its the nature of the beast. Im a hypocrite I suppose but Im at peace with it now.x

[zazen999]

Absolutely. Just cut down or cease eating meat. I did it overnight. In those days though, you had to do your own cooking as there was little out there to buy to supplement [cheese and onion pasties, and lasagna which I still refuse to eat out on principle].

It's a shame that all these chefs that go on and on about how fab they are, can't invent their own dishes for non meat eaters. I'm quite lucky as I have a few excellent veggie eateries nearby who offer excellent veggie food for paying customers. I refuse point blank to go to anywhere that offers 'vegetarian option available'. If meat eaters are deemed adult enough to make a choice, why shouldn't we be? I don't want to go somewhere where the only choice is a flaming puffy soaked pasta lasagna. Bleugh.

[janeyo]

My reasons for being veggie (24yrs) are pretty much the same as 2sheds - and zaazen, so no need ro repeat them

The four veggie cookbooks I use the most are
isbn 0-7525-2059-8 - the complete book of vegetarian cooking
isbn 978-1-4054-9399-4 everyday vegetarian
isbn 1-85813-420-x step by step vegetarian cooking
isbn 0-600-57528-4 hamlyn vegetarian cookbook

[Two_Sheds]

militant veggies

I've never met one of those. Vegetarians yes, but nobody militant or preachy about it