Disruption -Wednesday 30 November 2011

[zazen999]

Being a Private sector worker,i find the description above highly offensive and typical of public sector greed!

Why is that offensive? Am I missing something?

[mothhawk]

[FionaH]

Now Now people keep your rattles in your prams.

If I who is to the right of Khengis Khan can remain civil others should find it easy so lets not get personal please. Colin

Indeed, lets keep it polite please, there is a whole other thread about this strike that has remained civil and courteous, lets not blow it now eh?

I notice there are a lot of people knocking the bankers, but have you ever thought that without investment bankers you would not have a pension that is any pension at all.

Colin

Ummm many people haven't got a pension that is any pension at all, or am I missing the point?

[SarzWix]

Newton, when I talk about the ridiculous amount of money hoarded by corporations, and pensions, I'm not suggesting that should become the pension pot. I'm suggesting that it is invested in capital projects (building things) and job creation, which would then bring in revenues (taxes and NI) for use by the gov't in the things that they are cutting. This is, after all, how capitalism is supposed to be 'fair', it's called 'trickle down', whereby the money amassed at the top is supposed to find its way down to the peasants. As anyone with two open eyes and a couple of brain cells can see, it isn't working, as the money IS hoarded and instead the peasants are paying in job losses, benefit cuts, house repossessions, pension cuts, higher education cuts, lost public services...

scarletrunner, what Pigletwillie (and many other people) is saying, is that instead of public sector pensions being reduced to the value (or nonexistence) of private sector pension provision, that private sector provision ought to be raised to the level of public sector. I don't see anything in that to be offended by.

[pigletwillie]

Being a Private sector worker,i find the description above highly offensive and typical of public sector greed!

I too work in the private sector and for three years have had no pay rise and last year took a 5% cut so I find your comments rather poor and scrooge-esque.

Now, is it in my and indeed everybody elses interests to have terms and conditions of work and pensions slowly eroded to the lowest common denominator or is it not better for them to rise and become a gold standard across the board. The politics of envy and greed have been an achilles heel for the Labour party for years as has that of divide and conquer been one for the Tories.

Why should we not all have a reasonable pension?

[FionaH]

Now, is it in my and indeed everybody elses interests to have terms and conditions of work and pensions slowly eroded to the lowest common denominator or is it not better for them to rise and become a gold standard across the board. The politics of envy and greed have been an achilles heel for the Labour party for years as has that of divide and conquer been one for the Tories.

Why should we not all have a reasonable pension?

Not often I find myself agreeing with you on political matters

[scarletrunner]

I too work in the private sector and for three years have had no pay rise and last year took a 5% cut so I find your comments rather poor and scrooge-esque.

Now, is it in my and indeed everybody elses interests to have terms and conditions of work and pensions slowly eroded to the lowest common denominator or is it not better for them to rise and become a gold standard across the board. The politics of envy and greed have been an achilles heel for the Labour party for years as has that of divide and conquer been one for the Tories.

Why should we not all have a reasonable pension?

"Standard and across the board".That would be ideal instead of an "us and them"divide.I interpreted wrongly your original quote,thinking you were insinuating that private sector workers were off a lower class,or words to that effect.

[pigletwillie]

I thought my post was fairly unambiguous but hey ho.

We need to move away from the "I'm all right jack, well I haven't got it so nor should they" mentality and hold firm. Yes firms are there to make a profit but that does not mean they they cannot treat people ethically and with dignity who work for them. Phillip Green is happy to drag £1 billion out of his company for his wife but seems loathe to spend 1/10th of that on pension provision for his staff.

May I also add that his wifes billion pound check was paid offshore so denying the British government of some £450 million of tax revenue.

[BUFFS]

everybody seems to be missing the point ,had maggie and her morons not allowed the private pension pretenders (providers?)to change the rules before they started promoting workers,not just bosses pensions (different rules...what a surprise) then the average private pension would be a very package to what is on offer now,it would have been worth saving for,and as a result the public pensions would be seen for what they are...and government announcements,i couldnt trust a regime whose first acts were to attack the sick and disabled.today we hear what was agreed by cameron and the yankie medical firms when he had all those meetings before the election..giving access to our research,then applying patents in america,then making us pay thru the nose for our own inventions,its happened so many times before,but i suppose one of the politicos will get a well paid directorship,so they wont see anything wrong with the whole setup....just thinking,wasnt there a regime in the 30s whose first target was the sick and disabled,history repeating itself again....

[chris]

If we're going to revive this thread, let's keep it on track and the personal nitpicks/insults to a minimum please

[Two_Sheds]

Not often I find myself agreeing with you on political matters

Me neither. I'm liking this New Man

[Two_Sheds]

anyone with two open eyes and a couple of brain cells can see, it isn't working, as the money IS hoarded [by the rich]

As noted by someone on R4 this week, when poor people are given an income, they spend it on food and clothes, usually locally, thereby keeping local shops in business.
Rich people, when given a pay rise, tend to "trouser it" [their term], either investing it or spending it on luxuries ~ foreign holidays, foreign goods etc

Taking yet more money off the poor is having the double whammy of putting town centres out of business and creating yet more unemployed

[Two_Sheds]

bins are likely not to be emptied regularly in the coming months........ok for TS cause she is a recycling goddess

There's no need to be sarky, just because I'm trying to clean up after myself and not expect other people to do it for me

[Mikey]

I'm sure I read somewhere the other day that the review on public sector pensions as yet does not include politicians?

Is this correct?

[Two_Sheds]

I posted that on the other thread Mikey