excess packaging

[bubblewrap]

And those mentally unbalanced souls who place 'additives' in the food, that is an issue for Patricia Hewitt to solve.

Patricia Hewitt? I wouldn't trust to gaurd my locked garden shed!

[bubblewrap]

Are you sure that paper bags are more ecologically sound than plastic ones?
Bare in mind that they are heavier and have higher transport costs that increases the carbon dioxide signature and other transport pollution.
They still require chemical processing to produce.
They also require more trees to be cut down, which has implications on forestry management and such ecosystems. For example, if a paper shortage arises we could see hardwood forests being converted to softwood ones that don't support the same amount of wildlife, firstly due to the nature of their species and secondly due to methods such as short rotation harvesting.

This is just a suggestion and I would like some hard evidence before I convert to a plastic-free attitude.

At least you can "compost" paper bags.

[pigletwillie]

M&S did an environmental impact study with regard to paper bags and found that plastic bags were less damaging to the environment to produce and transport to store.

However, paper or plastic we need to reuse more and use less new ones.

[shirlthegirl43]

And those mentally unbalanced souls who place 'additives' in the food, that is an issue for Patricia Hewitt to solve.

Patricia Hewitt? I wouldn't trust to gaurd my locked garden shed!

Madmax agrees

[shirlthegirl43]

M&S did an environmental impact study with regard to paper bags and found that plastic bags were less damaging to the environment to produce and transport to store.

However, paper or plastic we need to reuse more and use less new ones.

That does surprise me. However, while I can re-use the carrier bags and do so, the bags that bug me are the ones you have to put the loose veg into.

[Two_Sheds]

Are you sure that paper bags are more ecologically sound than plastic ones?
... I would like some hard evidence before I convert to a plastic-free attitude.

you are funny!

why do we need a new bag each time we shop anyway? Take one with you. I have cloth ones (50p) that roll up sausage-size to tuck into a pocket. If you want smarter, Tesco and others are selling fold up bags now (50p). If you use a car to shop, keep a couple of plastic crates in the boot instead of bags.

Or if you want to keep the kids busy today, get them sewing...
http://www.abolishplasticbags.org.uk...e_your_own_bag

[SimonCole]

Can you prove that non-recycled cloth bags are more ecologically sound?

[rustylady]

I have a "One Stop" shop at the top of the street I live in. I know all the staff, I often call in there for milk (occasionally a bottle of wine), etc. They automatically put your shopping into a plastic carrier and always look really surprised when I say I don't need a bag. 1. I only live just down the road and rarely buy much from there. and 2. I usually have my "granny bag" with me (a proper cloth reusable bag)

[Alison]

That does surprise me. However, while I can re-use the carrier bags and do so, the bags that bug me are the ones you have to put the loose veg into.

You don't have to put your veg in them, it annoys them at the check out a bit but you can just take your veg through without a bag. Admitedly this would work better for larger products but it would be a start. Also, you can reuse bags from a previous shopping expedition if you want.

Can you prove that non-recycled cloth bags are more ecologically sound?

Of course it's more ecologically sound to reuse a bag over and over again whether it's recycled or not. OK so it would be even better if you make one from old curtains or something but a decent bag that will last is a good thing. OK so most of my shopping bags are climate neutral (I know you'll doubt this, but they are) and made from renewable sources but anything is better than not bothering. Even reusing a plastic bag is better than getting a new one each time but the best is to use a bag which will last you for years - and then remember to take it with you.

[Two_Sheds]

Can you prove that non-recycled cloth bags are more ecologically sound?

Oh, you do make me laugh, stop it!

It's a no-brainer

no explanation needed, surely?

[vertangie]

In Penrith last year they had a day where they were trying to encourage recycling so they were giving away canvas bags made from recylced material to people who would sign a pledge to use them. I told them I already had bags I take to the supermarket (lakeland insulated big square things) but they said that meant I was already doign my bit and ti have 1 anyway.

It's a great idea, local council just give them to people who agree to use them.

Angie

[SimonCole]

Oh, you do make me laugh, stop it!

It's a no-brainer

no explanation needed, surely?

Please forgive me for my ignorance, but I do need a little more explanation. What would be great is if you could fill me in on the following:

Are the bags you bought made out of synthetic fibre?
How do you account for the ecological damage by their production? such as the sulphur dioxide emissions from the manufacture of dyes and bleaches?
If they are cotton, how does land degradation (salinization) caused by cotton farming in the middle-east, balance up against the cons of plastic bags?

I'd agree that we need better waste management to deal with plastic disposal. For example, the dumping of domestic waste at sea has had a dramatic effect on seabird populations (through ingestion). But the problem does not lie just within the shores of the U.K. We actually manage our waste well enough to ensure that it is either recycled or dumped in landfill sites, not in the sea. I have always disagreed with the idea that if we all do our bit, then the problem will go away... we actually need to do more on an international scale, considering other peoples lives and not just those of our own! That is, if you are serious about environmental issues, you need to be active in campaigning about global issues and not just buying a bag and talking the talk!

[Two_Sheds]

some good points, well made Simon.
I get your drift re: manufacturing the cotton bags, but it is one bag (reused - and I only wash it when really needed) versus a new bag each and every time I go shopping.

If we all do our bit the problem won't nec. go away, but the problem will be made that bit smaller. As for campaigning...do you think that works? you can't change someone else's behaviour, but you can change your own. Lead by example.

[Headfry]

I never know what I can and can not recycle!!! what about the things that pills come in? plastic and tin foil
the clear wrappers from veg/ fruit?
nets that the above also come in?

I really want to recycle every thing I can, but How do I know what is what!
It's a mine field out there?

Makes me mad

[zebedee]

About packaging etc, I totally agree, it's 95% unnecessary. However, Somerfields do issue carrier bags made out of potato starch. Do any other supermarkets do this?