Gardening in Portugal. Sailing in Devon.

[Jay-ell]

Oooh, I'm so envious - sounds like a great plot.

How long have you had yours? Do you grow fruit trees?
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I got the first plot in 2015 and the second the following year. Let's say that they were doer uppers.

https://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gr...ana_84270.html

I've a little bit of fruit on the plots. Rather than type it all again, here's a post describing it

https://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gr...ml#post1610679

The square foot orchard is a 10' x4' bed with 7 apples, 2 pears, 2 plums and a cherry.

The pomegranate and olive didn't go in (pomegranate is a goner, olive hijacked into a pot in the garden) and the chillean guava are going into pots so they can be overwinrered in the greenhouse.

I've also added another kiwi fruit.

[simplesamen]

Yes - this will be my 4th season. It's stronger and sweeter than the versions you buy in shops. Plus it's really undemanding though it needs its own space. Multiplies like rabbits too so make sure you have lots of space. I got 3g (dried weight) from two 1x5m beds last year, which sounds like nothing but that's enough for me all year.

Oh my gosh, just read up about saffron! How could this luscious spice NOT be on my radar!?
I'll be ordering corms immediately. Do you mind me asking how many corms did you initially buy and was this enough to fill your 1x5m beds? Or has the bed filled up over time with the spreading? Trying to get a feel for my first order I plan to wild plant them in 'patches' as a kind of ground cover, rather than in a dedicated bed. As a saffron pro grower, any thoughts on that approach?

My carob is only 2. 6 more years till I find out whether I've grown any female plants or whether they are all boys. 50/50 chance with each seed...

Did you buy your carob seeds, or trade? I'm hoping to trade with the neighbours...or forage wild, no chance of guaranteeing male/female plants tho. I see your based in London, do you plant carob straight into the garden?

[simplesamen]

I got the first plot in 2015 and the second the following year. Let's say that they were doer uppers.

https://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gr...ana_84270.html

I've a little bit of fruit on the plots. Rather than type it all again, here's a post describing it

https://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gr...ml#post1610679

Wow. What a transformation...the Jungle looks like a whole different plot compared to your starting point! It's great to see this as my little plot will probably cover about the same area as yours! I'm hoping to keep mine as wild as possible. Maybe a few raised beds. If I can create walkways and then plant inbetween the spaces left by the pathways with lots of different varieties that would be the design I'll be chasing! Do you companion plant on your plots?

The pomegranate and olive didn't go in (pomegranate is a goner, olive hijacked into a pot in the garden) and the chillean guava are going into pots so they can be overwinrered in the greenhouse.

I have three pomegranate trees on the plot that look dead as doornails! I was going to rip them out, but I learned that pomegranates 'play dead' and to just ignore their silly games and continue with pruning! They sucker like crazy too, throwing up little volunteers. If I get one growing, I'll be happy to donate it to the Jungle! Or send seeds, if you want to start a pomegranate forest!

[sparrow100]

I bought 60 corms to begin with. Each produced 5-8 corms of varying size in the first year. I would give it its own space. Lots of people moan that saffron disappears over time and generally that's about planting in the wrong place. It will disappear if it gets too congested, not fed at the right time or has to compete for space. Or it's in boggy ground, which it dislikes. (I have a longer thing about looking after saffron here: https://mudandgluts.com/unusual-crops/saffron/

Plus you will have bare earth April-September when it's dormant. I have trialled growing dwarf beans on top this year, and green manure. The latter was not a success, will note whether the beans have had an impact on production when the corms wake up.

Carob was from fresh seeds - we ate the pods and I thought I would give growing the seeds a go. They are in pots and still tiny, only 6-8 inches high but they grow slowly and are neglected, as is everything I grow!

I have a pomegranate too - it's survived general neglect here, and been outside in a pot for 3ish years, including the last severe winter. I got it as a tiny seedling from ex-FIL's garden in Italy. I love the fruit fresh off the tree, but will settle for enjoying blossom over here if it ever gets big enough.

[Jay-ell]

I don't companion plant. I do bung plants in where there's enough space for them so I might have kale, sweet cicely , Lovage, walking onions, bronze fennel, rhubarb an babington leeks bunged in one bed with Cardoon, sorrel, good king henry, welsh onions and sand leeks bunged in a patch elsewhere.

Another place seems to have day lillies (a recent addition), bergamont, nine star cauliflower, skirret, scorzonera and annual leeks that have be turned to the dark side and gone perennial.

My perennial patch isn't very large at the moment and needs revamping once I get rid of all the weed control membrane at the bottom of the beds (there's always some thing better to do rather than dig out the fabric from a couple of planted beds).

By the way - skirret and scorzonera are great for a perennial /naturalised root veg patch. They can both be regrown from offsets so when you harvest them you can take off the side shoots and plant them back out to get the next crop - I've three patches of scorzonera that came back from snapped roots. Both are perennials and are happy to sit a couple of years between harvests. Both are also liked by bees - skirret with it's white umbels and scorzonera with masses of yellow flowers.

p.s. Earth Chestnut (Bunium bulbocastanum) might also be another perennial root crop. I haven't harvested my plants yet to see how much they produce but they are loved by bees again.

Tiger nuts are another great perennial root crop if you like the flavour of coconut - but I guess given the right conditions could become invasive as they're the swollen roots of a sedge. Google horchata to see one way to stop them being invasive.

[Two_Sheds]

Collecting local native seeds and taking cuttings

Well, I can tell you the best time to take cuttings ...

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... when nobody’s looking 😂😂

[simplesamen]

I bought 60 corms to begin with. Each produced 5-8 corms of varying size in the first year. I would give it its own space. I have a longer thing about looking after saffron here: https://mudandgluts.com/unusual-crops/saffron/

Great thread, thank you for the link. Lots of good tips! Sounds like it'll do better in a dedicated area rather than intermingled with other plants.

Carob was from fresh seeds - we ate the pods and I thought I would give growing the seeds a go. They are in pots and still tiny, only 6-8 inches high but they grow slowly and are neglected, as is everything I grow!

I do the same...every time I eat something I'm checking out the seeds and wondering if I can grow it! I'll be foraging for carob seed this autumn, would love to get a carob tree started on the plot.

I have a pomegranate too - it's survived general neglect here, and been outside in a pot for 3ish years, including the last severe winter. I got it as a tiny seedling from ex-FIL's garden in Italy. I love the fruit fresh off the tree, but will settle for enjoying blossom over here if it ever gets big enough.

The three pomegranates I have on the plot we're looking rather spindly and forlorn back in March, but should perk up with a bit of pruning and attention. They're right on the waters edge too, so it might be smart for me to grab some seedlings and relocate them back a bit. Good to hear your seedling survived the transportation from Italy. Nothing yummier than freshly picked pomegranates

[simplesamen]

Well, I can tell you the best time to take cuttings ...

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... when nobody’s looking ����

Can't agree more!
Just like the best anchorages are those arrived at after dark, and left before dawn!

[simplesamen]

I bought 60 corms to begin with. Each produced 5-8 corms of varying size in the first year. I would give it its own space. I have a longer thing about looking after saffron here: https://mudandgluts.com/unusual-crops/saffron/

Btw, discovered this when reading up about growing saffron...thought it would be rude not to pass on a Spiced Saffron Martini recipe!

[simplesamen]

By the way - skirret and scorzonera are great for a perennial /naturalised root veg patch. They can both be regrown from offsets so when you harvest them you can take off the side shoots and plant them back out to get the next crop - I've three patches of scorzonera that came back from snapped roots. Both are perennials and are happy to sit a couple of years between harvests. Both are also liked by bees - skirret with it's white umbels and scorzonera with masses of yellow flowers.

Earth Chestnut (Bunium bulbocastanum) might also be another perennial root crop. I haven't harvested my plants yet to see how much they produce but they are loved by bees again.

Tiger nuts are another great perennial root crop if you like the flavour of coconut - but I guess given the right conditions could become invasive as they're the swollen roots of a sedge. Google horchata to see one way to stop them being invasive.

Every time I read one of your posts I'm so inspired by the diversity you have growing in your plots. Here's hoping to a similar diversity once I get my little plot up and running! Thanks for all the suggestions...loving these root veggies/ground nuts! Cant wait to source some and get them started. And that milk drink! My kind of 'invasive species control'!! Yum

[Paulieb]

Hi and welcome. This is my first post in a LONG time!

Sounds like a nice setup you have. I love Portugal and go every year to the Algarve, but I stay in the west end of the Algarve where its nice and quite and lots of locals to talk to.

This year I did lots of running around the back roads, and nearly every property had an allotment in their garden, which I nosily peeked into whilst running past!!

I spied the following plants. Lots of sweetcorn, courgettes, squashes and potatoes. Their onions looked great, as all of these tend to like the heat, with accompanying water....every garden had irrigation systems (presumably connected to mains water), so provided you have a water system up and running then these won't be a problem.

As far as perennials go, I would go for some peaches, nectarines, apricots too. I also saw a few Quince trees, which like it warmer, and then loads of grapes. Best way to obtain these would be from a supplier in Portugal, to ensure you get varieties that are suited to the climate.

Chillis and toms should be fine outside so they'll be good ones to grow.

Regarding garlic, you'd probably be best buying some in Portugal to grow. Varieties you buy here are suited to our climate, and vice versa, I have grown Portuguese garlic in the UK and the results were nowhere near those of the 'UK garlic'.

Having varieties that are suited to the climate will make your job a million times easier in terms of the effort you need to put in to maintain them, especially as you may not be there all of the time.

[veggiechicken]

Every time I read one of your posts I'm so inspired by the diversity you have growing in your plots. Here's hoping to a similar diversity once I get my little plot up and running! Thanks for all the suggestions...loving these root veggies/ground nuts! Cant wait to source some and get them started. And that milk drink! My kind of 'invasive species control'!! Yum

Before you plant tiger nuts, have a read of Zenith's posts in https://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gr...own_74656.html

[Jay-ell]

Every time I read one of your posts I'm so inspired by the diversity you have growing in your plots. Here's hoping to a similar diversity once I get my little plot up and running! Thanks for all the suggestions...loving these root veggies/ground nuts! Cant wait to source some and get them started. And that milk drink! My kind of 'invasive species control'!! Yum

You might want to start the tiger nut in containers as they might be more likely to survive over winter in Portugal than the North East.

[sparrow100]

Plus I found the tiger nuts grown in open soil, as opposed to in compost, absolutely impossible to clean.

Mine didn't survive the Beast from the East, and I don't think I will bother with them again.

[simplesamen]

Before you plant tiger nuts, have a read of Zenith's posts in https://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gr...own_74656.html

Thanks for the heads up veggiechicken, I love the idea of growing these little groundnuts (or indeed anything a little unusual) but looks like they need to be kept in check. Might try them in containers first!