Planning permission for sheds

[rana]

In response to Barley Sugars original post - Are you allowed to erect a greenhouse. Following on from that when does a greenhouse become a shed. For instance - a pent shed with decent size windows and a clear roof with a few plants inside could be otherwise described as a greenhouse.

[EddieJ]

still usable sheds, would have to go to landfill..
Daft if you ask me.
Roger

That is an interesting point, and leads on from Sarah's use of reclaimed items.

The following is going to sound like a wind up, but it isn't.

Did you know that the Government are currently looking into a scheme, whereby recycled low end goods, are turned into sheds. It's currently at the development stage, and I look forawrd to seeing how they intend to do this. I always thought that the Government was supposed to be non profit based, and taking the livelihood form existing shed making companies, could be very sticky.

If I can find some online info about this, I'll post it up.

[Alison]

I always thought that the Government was supposed to be non profit based, and taking the livelihood form existing shed making companies, could be very sticky.

Sorry, I really don't get the point you're making here and how that relates to the thread. In reference to your previous posts, you'd hate our site, we have a hotch potch of sheds and structures which are where we want them on the site and suit the plot holders' needs. They're different colours and designs but all contain allotment related items and would have no room for junk. There is one plot on our site which has been used as a tipping site (beds, radiators, chairs, all sorts) but that plot holder has been dealt with and the plot is being cleared without rules being enforced on the other plot holders who are getting on with growing fruit and veg rather than doing a Miss World for sheds

[zazen999]

The following is going to sound like a wind up, but it isn't.

yada yada yada

If I can find some online info about this, I'll post it up.

If you could, that would be great. Otherwise it does indeed look like a complete wind up. Cheers

[BarleySugar]

Replying to this tread has not been easy , I have lost my post twice, so third time lucky. Perhaps fate is trying to tell me something, or maybe I've just been careless.
I am surprised at some of the comments I have read, especially in the light of the cost involved to taxpayers. I work, pay tax and council tax, and do not begrudge the sites that come with facilities provided by the council, and managed by the officer responsible for leisure and amenities. However our site is going to cost probably twice the rent for half the ground just to pay our way, and we have to run it ourselves too!

The council is leasing the land from a local landowner that we had to find ourselves, as we were told no land was available, and even if it were, the council had no money to fulfil their obligation. Since this we have negotiated an informal agreement, then had to wait for the council to do their legal bit (for which the must have paid the legal bill) in getting the lease signed.
Originally we were told we wouldn't need planning, that was until 6 people objected. We have over 50 people on the waiting list. Planning applications do not come free, and they also require accurate site plans and surveys. Luckily we had people on the waiting list who were prepared to do this work for nothing. However apart from that, we have to find the funding for the planning fee and set up costs ourselves. We have our commitee taken from volunteers on the waiting list who have had to work on finding grants, writing begging letters to local businesses and fund raising at fetes, boot fairs and running raffles. Not an easy task in any case, especially when we only had a promise to work with.

This weekend we have people preparing the water pipes and taps on site, ready for connection to the mains water (another cost). We need to still find grants to pay for car parking, which as it isn't a 'green' issue is hard, as well as security in the form of gates, keys etc.

This site would not exist at all if it weren't for us being willing to shoulder the burden of the council's legal responsibility. It doesn't seem much to expect them not to put obstacles in our way at every turn and to ensure we are given the correct information so we can get this site up and running as soon as practical.

[Aberdeenplotter]

Well done for sticking with it. Hope you get to the finishing line soon.

[Snadger]

Our Tenacy agreement stipulates that any NEW structure including sheds, greenhouses and fences that are over one metre high needed permission from the Council.
No mention of existing structures though.

I suppose this could be deemed as 'planning permission' but in theory, because it's part of the Tenancy agreement their is no choice but to conform. (Not that anyone ever has as far as I know?)

[BigShot]

Sarz - I appear to have "liked" several of your posts in this thread. Sorry for flooding your notifications inbox... though really it's your own fault for making such excellent points.


I sent an email to NSALG about planning permission or sheds and greenhouses and got this (paraphrased) in return.

* On council land, no planning permission is needed, though the tenancy agreement may require permission [as distinct from planning permission].
* On private land, planning permission IS needed for sheds and greenhouses.
* Allotments do not enjoy the lawful development rights of agricultural land or dwellinghouse land for structure building.

I'm waiting to hear back about allotments sited ON agricultural land, but the reply was surprisingly clear-cut for a question about planning.

[Alison]

Our Tenacy agreement stipulates that any NEW structure including sheds, greenhouses and fences that are over one metre high needed permission from the Council.
No mention of existing structures though.

I suppose this could be deemed as 'planning permission' but in theory, because it's part of the Tenancy agreement their is no choice but to conform. (Not that anyone ever has as far as I know?)

We have to get permission from the Parish council if we want to have any structures (well it says so in our contract) however they seemed very confused when I asked

[BarleySugar]

Our new site is on agricultural land, and a change of use was not required from DEFRA, but we still had to apply for planning permission. Anyone wanting to put up more than the one designated shed will have to apply for permission seperately (we have had several people ask about greenhouses and chicken coops). Fingers crossed, the planning committee meet on Thursday. I was surprised it had to go to committee actually, because when I recently did the planning training for the parish council, we were told most applications are decided by a planning officer, and the committee does not always need to meet.

[fred6]

I used to have an allotment. It was owned by the council and run by a committee. Everyone who wanted one had a shed - all different sizes too, and many had a greenhouse in addition. No one bothered about planning permission and no planners ever bothered us. Planners are bureaucrats and like all bureaucrats their No. 1 priority is keeping themselves in a job so they play on the general ignorance of the public and invent rules. One should always ask by what authority (ie statute law) they are operating under. Planners have no statutory authority to make laws of their own. Erecting a shed is not development and so should not require PP. If it was your garden then within certain parameters the General Development Order would allow you to do "anything that is necessary for the enjoyment of the occupants of the house" why it should be different for allotments I do not know.

[Snadger]

Poor Mark!

Mark, who is a very keen gardener and keeps his allotment spotless, fell foul of the new allotments committee.
I was under the asumption that the allotment committee were there for the benefit of the allotmenteers and and not for the sake of there own little personal crusades or axes to grind against others.
Thas why I chucked it as Secretary because I wanted to do the best I could for ALL the folks who had allotments on our site and not be part of a geriatric 'clique'.

Anyway, to sum it up, he got a letter from the Council because some of the geriatrics had grassed him up about erecting a small, new shed at the top of his plot.

He's taken it down now to keep the peace and all I could say to him was "What goes around, comes around"
The annoying thing is that the guys that grassed him up have brick built buildings with woodburners, piped heating systems and even gas cookers in them.
They sit weedwatching at the allotments to save on heir heating bills at home, but put the boot in when anyone else wants a new shed stating that there buildings were built before the 'new laws'

[Thelma Sanders]

That is very sad

[baldrick]

Poor Mark!

Mark, who is a very keen gardener and keeps his allotment spotless, fell foul of the new allotments committee.
I was under the asumption that the allotment committee were there for the benefit of the allotmenteers and and not for the sake of there own little personal crusades or axes to grind against others.
Thas why I chucked it as Secretary because I wanted to do the best I could for ALL the folks who had allotments on our site and not be part of a geriatric 'clique'.

Anyway, to sum it up, he got a letter from the Council because some of the geriatrics had grassed him up about erecting a small, new shed at the top of his plot.

He's taken it down now to keep the peace and all I could say to him was "What goes around, comes around"
The annoying thing is that the guys that grassed him up have brick built buildings with woodburners, piped heating systems and even gas cookers in them.
They sit weedwatching at the allotments to save on heir heating bills at home, but put the boot in when anyone else wants a new shed stating that there buildings were built before the 'new laws'

Be it an allotment dog club PTA...in fact any committee you care to mention you will find a couple of a**e holes in it for the power and a handful of "pressed men" expected to fire bullets for them in order to stop the committee and possibly the entire organisation folding. Ive had a bellyfull of committees in general as this is the sort of thing you come up against time and time again....and woe betide anyone who defends the newcomer against unfair treatment. As for the shed issue...well IMO a shed is an essential part of an allotment. Only someone who doesnt have an allotment can assume a small tool store is sufficient. Where are you supposed to rest out of rain or sun without a shed? What about storage of netting, stakes,canes, tarps for covering resting bits? Where do you stash the kids for a warm while you work? What about your pee bucket??? The point about the Enclosures Act was a good one. Allotments are, or should be our right. Would the miserable so and sos who object to sheds, parking, traffic etc be happier if the land was built on with the additional traffic that brings? Think not somehow. My council tax pays for kids playparks my kids never use and "playing fields " which in reality are just football fields even tho I loathe football but I accept our society deems these things necessary. What happens if someone onlt wants a small cheap 6x4 shed instead of the larde specified size? Ludicrous.