manure

[yellow strawberry]

I would plant the beds up with winter veg. (not into this leaving land fallow idea!) Chuck the manure into a heap and let it rot.
Come spring/summer as the winter crop is taken out, add the, by then, well rotted manure, and plant up again straight away!

Whatever you do with the manure, don't dig it in, let the worms take it in or only tickle it into the top 4 inches of soil.

i do intend putting some winter veg in but the soil is really bad not sure it will grow well (any suggestions what veg i can put in we have no plants ),,we haven't got an area we can leave the manure to rot apart from paths coz we are having a communal one ,,and no i wasn't going to dig it in the worms can do that for me

[yellow strawberry]

I would say "why bother?" Just get the manure and plonk it onto the dirt ASAP and then dig it in soon as you can. The sooner you do that, the sooner the worms will start to live in the soil.

that's why i asked the original question,,,the bays will be ready for next year,, i hope, so we can get manure rotted down and wont need to leave my beds empty

[Two_Sheds]

Yellow S, what is on the ground at the moment? Any weeds? Do you know what they are?

(my point being that if weeds can grow, then veg plants can grow ~ you certainly do not need to wait months & months until the soil magically becomes friable.)

Your ground is hard: I'm guessing it's clay then. Very nutritious, very good for growing veg.

You can plant something now to start improving the soil now ~ you don't even have to dig the plot over to get started, just get some plants and dig one small hole per plant and whack them in. I would go buy some squash plants: their foliage will shade a lot of ground, preventing weeds from taking over. You may not get good crops (it's late in the year for pumpkins, but courgettes should still produce something). Cabbages also get very big and can cover a good metre of soil each.

You won't necessarily find worms when you dig, it doesn't always mean the soil is poor. In summer the top layers of soil dry out and the worms move deeper underground to get the moisture.

To do a worm test, you could water a small patch really well, then cover with a sheet of black plastic, or several newspapers, or cardboard. Wait a few days or pref. weeks, then lift the mulch up and check again for worms

[Dynamo]

The reason I prefer to dig the manure in is because I find it dries out too much when its left to cover just the top of the soil and some of it blows away. When I said dig it in though, I didn't mean in deep. Just enough, as Snadger says just into the top 4 inches will be fine.

I'm looking to get two huge cart loads of manure, which is usually pretty well manured when it arrives, in the autumn, and I intend to get it dug in asap, mainly because I don't have anywhere to store a heap, but also because I want it to help improve the soil as soon as I can.

[jackie j]

Every year in the autumn I firstly make sure I have all the weeds out, then I cover the area where I am going to put my spuds with manure, I dont get any weeds apart from the one or two strong weeds, just before I put the spuds in I dig the manure in. I always get a good crop. I have taken over another plot that is very clay and claggy, I have grown some good veg in this soil even though it hasnt been manured, I do use chicken pellets for feed and scatter them around.

[yellow strawberry]

Yellow S, what is on the ground at the moment? Any weeds? Do you know what they are?

(my point being that if weeds can grow, then veg plants can grow ~ you certainly do not need to wait months & months until the soil magically becomes friable.)

Your ground is hard: I'm guessing it's clay then. Very nutritious, very good for growing veg.

You can plant something now to start improving the soil now ~ you don't even have to dig the plot over to get started, just get some plants and dig one small hole per plant and whack them in. I would go buy some squash plants: their foliage will shade a lot of ground, preventing weeds from taking over. You may not get good crops (it's late in the year for pumpkins, but courgettes should still produce something). Cabbages also get very big and can cover a good metre of soil each.

You won't necessarily find worms when you dig, it doesn't always mean the soil is poor. In summer the top layers of soil dry out and the worms move deeper underground to get the moisture.

To do a worm test, you could water a small patch really well, then cover with a sheet of black plastic, or several newspapers, or cardboard. Wait a few days or pref. weeks, then lift the mulch up and check again for worms

there are no weeds in at the minute coz the council scraped the land ,,it was derelict before it was turned into plots but yes it was weedy there was a lot of thistles there ,,the ground is hard not because it is clay just the fact it has never been cultivated ,,,,we have no water in the plot yet so i will fill something up and do a worm test like you say im sure there is some

[Snadger]

Nice looking plot and a lovely view in the distance.

I would still be inclined to grow something in those beds over winter. Spring cabbage can be sown now and broad beans and japanese onion sets can be planted later in the year. Mooli could still be sown also.

There are loads more veggies that could be sown or planted soon and also the soft/hard fruit planting season will soon be upon us.

Look forward to seeing how you progress!

PS Just hope the council haven't scraped off too much of your precious top soil!

[yellow strawberry]

Nice looking plot and a lovely view in the distance.

I would still be inclined to grow something in those beds over winter. Spring cabbage can be sown now and broad beans and japanese onion sets can be planted later in the year. Mooli could still be sown also.

There are loads more veggies that could be sown or planted soon and also the soft/hard fruit planting season will soon be upon us.

Look forward to seeing how you progress!

PS Just hope the council haven't scraped off too much of your precious top soil!

yes we have been hard at work all the beds are finished now ,,been through my seed box and got a fair bit that i can sow now ,,and some over wintering broadies ,,will get some garlic and onions as well ,,they did scrape some off ,,but they kindly gave us a couple of tonne to put back on ,,that didn't go far when its shared between 11 plots,,so i think i will use up half of the beds then use the other 4 beds to put a load of manure on so it can be rotting ,,,thanks for your help every one

[VirginVegGrower]

If the ground is really poor, then yes manure will improve it no end but it may well be an ongoing process over a number of years until the soil is in really good heart. It's good to establish a compost bin as well so that you can plough back into the plot as much as possible of what comes out of it (apart from what you eat of course). At this time of year, it may be worthwhile planting a green manure crop which when dug in will also help improve things.

I agree with AP - sow red clover now, dig in around Autumn (this will add nutrient). Follow this with rye and it will help break up your soil for Spring.

I use manure on some beds and it needs 6-12 months to be considered rotted. Perhaps store it in your manure bins - suggest pallets for building these.

[Calvados]

One reply say he dose not use manure. My ground is producing nearly everything dwarfed. Carrots, spring onions, long raddish and beetroot are non existent, yet the leaves on the carrots, beet and raddish look healthy. The spring onions are like blades of grass, my cabbage is dwarfed and my red cabbage has large leaves but will not ball. What can I do?
Calvados

[Two_Sheds]

Carrots, spring onions, long raddish and beetroot are non existent

How long have they been in?

The spring onions are like blades of grass

They do that. It really works wonders if you sow them in pots or modules, then transplant them

my cabbage is dwarfed and my red cabbage has large leaves but will not ball.

It's a bit early for hearts to form, imo, but it does depend when you planted them?