Anybody local to Oundle, I need to hire a man with rotorvator!

[Melsvintage]

Hello all,

I know many would say not to use one, but I have an area which ideally could do with rotorvating, it is way too large to dig by hand and no matter how many time is have put weed killer down, it keeps coming up, I think it may be ground elder? it is a nightmare, two years ago we had six pigs in that area, it was a wasteland, but after only a couple of months after they had gone, it was all green again.

Not that I do not like green, but that particular patch would be so good to grow on, it is incredibly fertile. So, with this in mind, I was hoping to hire someone with a rotorvator to come and do the deed.

We live close to Oundle nr Peterborough, any advice welcomed, I can't use on, my health would not allow it plus some are really big beasties, not sure I would wish to even attempt using one!

[WendyC]

If you rotavate ground elder or any perennial weed for that matter you will simply be chopping the roots up and spreading them about making the whole thing worse. Look on here for "lasagne" gardening or "no dig" gardening where people have covered similar plots to yours with cardboard and mulches and killed of the weeds that way. What is your thinking behind rotavating?

[Scarlet]

I have ground elder in my garden, every tiny piece grows into a lovely plant in seconds. I can understand why you want a rotavator, the white roots form a mat underground and it's very hard to dig. I've tried to get rid of it for years, covered it over and it popped up in the grass. Some people on here may have had luck getting rid of it completely but it's never really gone for me. That said if you've dug it over and got most of the root out when it shows again it is easy to follow the root along and get it in one piece, you can't turn your back on it. If you rotavate do so at your peril...

[Two_Sheds]

"Ground elder should be hoed off or dug out at every opportunity" to weaken the roots & eventually kill it off. Ground elder - Weed information - Organic Weed Management

Rotavating is a very efficient way to do root cuttings: you will end up with a bigger problem than you started with, unless you perhaps rotavate it several times, going back and taking out every bit of elder in between

[BertieFox]

Rotavating is NOT an easy option, and although you might start with a wonderfully looking plot all neatly turned over, what you will have done is brought all the annual weed seeds to the surface, and cut up all the roots of perennial weeds where they will start growing as soon as it warms up a bit.

A much better approach, though again NOT an 'easy option' is to sheet mulch the ground and then tackle it a little at a time. Essentially you cover the ground with a light excluding substance like cardboard, and then cover this with a suitable material like compost (mushroom compost is great if you can get it by the trailer load), woodchippings or even straw. Everything, especially the cardboard, must be wetted thoroughly, if you want to plant through it almost immediately and there isn't much rain.

Potatoes make a very good first crop with this method, and the seed potatoes can simply be placed on the soil in a hole in the cardboard and then covered up with compost. As they grow, keep covering them with more compost, straw, hay or whatever you can get. You must keep the light away from the tubers or they will grow green.

Keep bringing in more and more mulch materials and smothering any weeds that get through, and by the second year you will have something much more like a manageable plot.

The drawback of this method which DOES work fantastically well, is that you need LOTS and LOTS of mulch materials and it can only be done if you have got a source of cheap materials like woodchips. Never dig the unrotted mulch into the soil or you will rob nitrogen, but on the surface it eventually makes an ideal planting medium through which you can sow or plant.

[Two_Sheds]

..., if you want to plant through it almost immediately

It's a good technique, I use it myself, but it's not suitable for perennial weeds: they will seek out any available chink of light, ie the planting hole, and the weed will then grow in amongst the crop where it'll be next to impossible to remove it.


With perennials like ground elder, couch grass, bindweed etc, you can't plant crops with them ~ they just get swamped

[Melsvintage]

Hi all, sorry for the late reply, I thought I had turned on instant e-mail? Thank you for your advice and taking the time to reply!

I was only going by what a local advised, i have been looking at pictures of ground elder today and not so sure whether it is or not, I shall take some photos tomorrow as is bucketing down, the stuff I have is more fern like- masses of it- and stinky too, this stuff grows to about 6ft in height when it starts to flower if I do not cut it down, but I have used lots of techniques and it still keeps coming back.

This year I was going to grow all my Courgettes, marrows and pumpkins down there, I can't help thinking they may do ok in amongst it all., if I were just to dig the planting spot and like someone said, mulch where the plants trail overhead, it is a huge area and I would need an awful lot of mulch to cover it all up. I would guess about 80 or more tons to cover it just a couple of inches. I shall step it out this afternoon so shall have an idea of how many metres it is.

This particular part of the field is actually very easy to dig, one section it is almost peat like, I can't help but think there may have been another pond down there a long long time ago, we actually dug a load out last year and it was like digging blocks of compost, very strange, but I had potatoes in that area last year and they done better than all of the ones in pots/dustbins.

If the rain stops, I shall go and take a quick pic this afternoon, some does look like the elder it is all in between the ferny stuff, I think a photo or two may help, I always wanted that space for my allotment as the ground is very nice- it must be fertile, I have countless moles, if you dig a section it has hundreds of worms, almost like a gigantic wormery.

A Local farmer has said he would plough it for £100 which is simply too much for me living the very simple life- or at least trying the supposed good life!

[Two_Sheds]

the stuff I have is more fern like- masses of it- ... the ground is very nice- it must be fertile

Bracken then? It's used to make peat-free ericaceous compost, so yes the ground underneath it should be good

[Melsvintage]

That's it! that part of the field is covered with this and another- may be the elder.

[Melsvintage]

size of allotment 1

Hi,

I have just paced the area out and it is 35 x 40 metres, the fern is definitely bracken, it is all over and in abundance, can this be removed or could I actually grown in between it all?

[Scarlet]

If it was me and if the weed is a persistent as I've found my ground elder to be I would dig out what you can, plant your marrows and courgettes and mulch around them ( thick newspapers damped down or card). Try to keep on top of the weed when it shows it's ugly head. I wouldn't mulch all over, like my elder I think it would just move further out!
The RHS website has some good info. Worth noting is that it says the spores may be cancerous so don't pick them during late summer. Try to get them before they flower.
http://apps.rhs.org.uk/advicesearch/...e.aspx?pid=445

[Two_Sheds]

can this be removed ?

from my link, above: "Bracken is difficult to control, even for farmers and landowners. It can be checked by traditional methods, such as cutting, crushing and burning, but these are labour-intensive and do not kill the underground stems, from which the bracken can regenerate rapidly."

[Melsvintage]

Great, Thank you for the advice, I think I shall just mulch in the areas growing and trailing, I can get hold of straw cheap, would this also work as a ground cover, or would it just grow up through it, I'm not going to let anything go down there now!