New plot on poorly managed site

[TrixC]

We've recently taken on our first allotment, which is exciting. We're in London and having tried unsuccessfully for many years to get a plot, we were excited when we moved house and our local Council announced they were reopening the waiting list.

We're delighted to have the plot and have been working hard to get it going. However, we're finding it a bit demotivating to see the lack of compliance with basic site rules from some of the existing plot holders. Many plots on the site are completely overgrown and don't appear to have been cultivated this season. Our site has a no hosepipe rule but people are openly using them, recently someone has tampered with the water supply tank adjacent to our plot in a way that enables a hosepipe to be fitted but also makes our plot vulnerable to flooding. One of our nearby plotholders has two plots and one of them he has converted to an extension of his garden (his house backs on to the site), most of it is lawn with a few token fruit trees, and he waters the lawn with sprinklers! We have also seen people having bonfires, which are not permitted, and there is a large volume of rubbish building up in the communal shed.

As newbies we don't want to cause any friction, but we would like to see the site better managed. Anyone have any experience of how we might go about making or advocating for positive changes? The site is owned and managed by the local Council.

[alldigging]

I would go and see the local councillor and ask them to come and visit.

Turning allotment into private gardens is a huge no no!

Make a list of all the questions and be prepared for the flack. You can't make an omlette without breaking eggs, and if you're feeling stressed then you may as well rip the plaster off and let the council try and sort the mess out.
If you don't then you'll probably feel overwhelmed and then might give it up anyway.

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

[muddled]

The thing is, (apart from the water tank) do any of these behaviours actually affect YOU?

Someone made a plot an extension of their garden but if a large number of plots are overgrown I would think his lawn and fruit trees at least look cared for.
People use hosepipes? Well so do I. They are not permitted on my site either but I think that they should be, I don't monopolise the tap and pay a huge£100 a year for my tiny (less than) half plot......so I water any way I want to.

While I feel people should have good manners with bonfires, an awareness of wind direction and other plot users' comfort....if the smoke isn't coming at you, why would the fire upset you so much that you feel the need to take action?

My council (also in London) are only really interested in the rent.
They provide no services or facilities for allotment holders.
I don't think they'll care much even if you do inform them.....the other plotholders on the other hand....

[rustylady]

Do you have a site rep TrixC? How many plots on your site?

[1Bee]

My sympathies, that must be really frustrating.

I think my advice would mostly be that as you're so new, you're going to have to concentrate on keeping your own house in order first. :-/ Have a few chats with the site manager, trying to keep to positives first. If there are things you can practically tackle (rubbish in the shed?), volunteer to help with them. Is there a committee? Think about joining, concentrating on helping out for the first year or so before trying to get more compliance with the rules.

I think you need to build your capital/standing with the other plot holders before you rock the boat too much. That said, in my area of work it's been said that the trick is to rock the boat - but stay in it. ;-)

Enjoy your plot.

[Doomgerbil]

The garden one I would ignore. The hosepipe rule I would work to over-rule (but no sprinklers please). Overgrown plots are a big issue. On our site we have: the totally neglected, the come once in a blue moon so it overgrows and has to be cleared en masse, the struggling but trying (weeds winning in some places) (that's us lol, reducing the marestail, bramble and bindweed may take a few seasons) and the well-kept (usually retirees who seem to 'live' on their plots and/or live in houses bordering the site. There needs to be some balance reached that allows for those with little time, illness etc but expects regular attention to the plots.
If I was you I would concentrate on problems that directly affect you. This would be the damaged tank, adjacent weed infested plots and any bonfires that are dangerous or a direct problem for you. (on our site bonfires are allowed but we have to be considerate of the 'posh' houses behind us and the railway that runs alongside. My solution is a small 'log-burner, effectively a brassiere, from Asda, and keeping to small burns). In the first instance a casual chat with the site rep or/and council allotment officer would be advisable.

[TrixC]

I don't know how many plots there are on the site, but I would guess around 60. We don't have a site manager, just the council allotments officer who is responsible for all allotments across the borough, and doesn't seem that reliable (we had quite a big saga trying to get a key). There isn't a site rep or committee either - I'd be interested in starting one, but I'm not sure where to begin.

@muddled, I guess I believe that reasonable rules are there for everyone's benefit and ought to be followed. If the rules are not reasonable people can make the case to change them. With the allotment I'd also like to feel I'm part of a growing community rather than the every person for themselves mentality which characterises so many aspects of London life!

[sparrow100]

Personally I empathise. I find it frustrating when people can't be bothered to abide by their contract. But I also agree with muddled - how many of these things affect you personally? Other than the water tank and possibly the shed if you use it.

I'd start with getting your own plot sorted and figure out if you like veg growing there/the site is somewhere you want to be before trying to change habits that have probably been in place for years. Coming onto a new site and immediately pointing out all the issues could cause you a lot of hassle - particularly if the Council then actually can't be bothered to do anything about it, which might happen.

[TrixC]

Thanks for all the advice, perhaps I am getting more worked up than I need to. TBH we are getting a bit irritated with the guy who has the plot he uses as a garden, because he basically acts like he owns the place. Last week we were there in the evening watering and weeding and he turned up with a chainsaw and started removing a large tree from an adjacent garden (not his garden, presumably he was helping out a neighbour) then began cutting it up on the vacant plot next to ours. The noise was ear-splitting and continued for over an hour, and I really felt he could have said something to us, along the lines of "Hello, I'm about to make a lot of noise, do you mind?" The guy also lets his kids and their friends run around and play on the allotment. I also suspect, but don't know for sure, that it was him who vandalised the water tank - there are only three plots that use this particular water tank and the other people are also new and seem very pleasant and rule-abiding.

Maybe my irritation with this plotholder has spilled over to my irritation with the site in general. We weren't given much choice of plots - ours is at the far end of the site, maximum distance from the entrance and communal manure heap etc. Every time I go I walk past heaps of plots that are much better sited than ours, but don't appear to be being maintained at all. And we have to physically climb over the rubbish heap in the shed to get to our tool locker. I would find it difficult to personally remove the rubbish because it's bulky stuff and I don't have a vehicle.

[Guest]

It would annoy me, rules are there for everyone's benefit and it is a shame some people are happy to ignore them. However, having said that most people don't seem to even realise, as they never read the T+C's.

It is nice to hear you are happy to play a more active role site committee/ or manager. It would be worth talking to the council rep to see what could be done. You might be best just to take a breather and step away from the irritation situation before you start enforcing rules as you will get a lot of flack, very little support and will need immensely thick skin.

After reading one of your posts is there much of a community spirit on your plots? Would it be worth organising tidy days? open days? plant/seed swaps? plot bbq's? So people have more reason to mingle and you can get an idea of how others feel and take the site forward from there.

[muddled]

I'd start with a BBQ .....choose a weekend a couple of weeks away and say Saturday or Sunday to be confirmed according to numbers/weather; then ask folk if they'd be willing to come along a bit early and help you set up/ tidy up before it starts.

Also, someone on our site started a facebook page which enables plotholders to communicate with each other and through it quite a few little odd jobs have been undertaken and completed. Something like that would be perfect, along with a sign on the shed door to say "I'm planning to tidy this area up on such and such a day...if there's anything you don't want me to touch please label and/or stack against the wall" that way you are doing something positive and folk might get behind you and help out.

[muddled]

ps.... Using a chainsaw near you is just plain rude...and dangerous to your ears.

[Plot10]

My solution is a small 'log-burner, effectively a brassiere, from Asda, and keeping to small burns)

LOL - That's a novel use for one, what cup size is it?

Sorry to be pedantic, but it gave me a giggle and I couldn't resist - do you perhaps mean a brazier?

[Jay-ell]

LOL - That's a novel use for one, what cup size is it?

Sorry to be pedantic, but it gave me a giggle and I couldn't resist - do you perhaps mean a brazier?

Well, they're both something that builders use to keep their hands warm

I used to have a plot in Waltham Forest where the rules where hard coded into the contract instead of a separate rule book.

Whenever the rules in the contract change those on older (but still valid) contracts didn't want to change contract so the site I was on had people on a range of contracts with different restrictions and regulations.

[Jay-ell]

By the way your contact may say something like "plot holders are not permitted to have a bonfire which causes a nuisance" - this doesn't prohibited fires, just a very specific circumstance.

As the contract is a legal document you have to go by the meaning of the words - not what whoever wote them thought that they meant.

Firstly what is a bonfire? Dictionary definitions may vary a little but generally they go something like "a large open outdoor fire". LARGE and SMALL are subjective but basically small fires aren't by this definition bonfires. The same goes for fires set in incinerators ans they aren't open.

The term "cause a nuisance" has a specific meaning in law. It doesn't mean that the smoke from a fire or barbecue is a nuisance just because I want to sit in the garden but the smoke is drifting into it - not unless you have had a fire every day for an extended period of time- for anything to be classed as a nuisance it has to last for a prolonged period of time.

Although the allotments may be viewed as a single entity by others in the neighbourhood, each plot holder is a separate tenant which means that YOU have to have bonfires for a period of time to cause a nuisance, irrespective of what others have been doing.

Of course any fires, not just bonfires, can cause a nuisance and land you a £5000 - but only if YOU have caused a nuisance.

This is therefore miles away from the no fires rules people can think that line means - basically it adds no more constraints than those currently existing in law.