green manures..

[cptncrackoff]

Hi all, apologies for the absenteeism...
Life is just too hectic!
Rest assured plot 63 is still going strong!
I do visit the vine every now and then, see what's happening...going to make time to post more often..

Anyway...green manures..
I've decided to use overwintering green manures this year rather than the usual horse manure..
The horse manure is now in short supply, and I'm convinced that it's bringing in the majority of my weeds..

I've researched the web, and the forum and have decided on my different mixes of seeds for different beds.
The only thing I'm unsure about is the depth I can dig the greenery in when the time comes.
I always like to dig pretty deep,the green manure advice is generally to dig it in 15cms, I assume to benefit the topsoil rather than bury the benefit too deep to be beneficial.
Has anyone any first hand experience of burying green manure at different depths?
As always any input gratefully received!
Jon.

[Jay-ell]

How about chop of the greenery ans put it to one side, dig as normal then fork the greenery into the top layer?

[Sharpy]

I chop it down, spread it out, then cover it with a weed membrane and leave it to the worms and mother nature.

[bario1]

Never had any luck getting the damn stuff to grow, never mind digging it in!

[cptncrackoff]

I'm not sure I'm ready to go no dig quite yet!
I'm slowly converting from all out bare soil over winter.

[Sharpy]

I grew Phacilia, Crimson clover and Mustard. And found the stems on i think it was the Phacilia quite thick, but hollow and it was to be honest, a pain to dig in, hence why i just left it. Putting the membrane on it was purely to hold the weeds back.

[PyreneesPlot]

I use phacelia, too and also cut it down and cover with plastic. Then when I need to use the bed I remove the plastic and dump any unrotted stems on the compost. This year it went in the leek bed so was cut about 6 weeks before I thought I would be planting leeks and just before it started to set seed.
I have used one of the grasses and a clover and found they just kept growing back. Nightmare!

[Two_Sheds]

I'm unsure about is the depth I can dig the greenery in

No dig.

Nature doesn't dig. Just chop it up and leave on the surface as mulch

[mothhawk]

I find TwoSheds method best, just leave it on the surface, and after a couple of months it's mostly gone. The finer you chop it up, the quicker it will disappear.

If you really want to dig it in, then no deeper than your worms go, 'cos they are the guys who will really mix it up for you.

[mothhawk]

I use phacelia, too and also cut it down and cover with plastic. Then when I need to use the bed I remove the plastic and dump any unrotted stems on the compost. This year it went in the leek bed so was cut about 6 weeks before I thought I would be planting leeks and just before it started to set seed.
I have used one of the grasses and a clover and found they just kept growing back. Nightmare!

That's an important tip, PP, thanks. I had a packet of red clover seeds, but was a little concerned it might be difficult to get rid of, so I sowed a few in a pot last spring, and planted one seedling out in the garden as a test. It seemed quite innocuous and stayed in its spot, so I left it to grow.

A couple of weeks ago I felt it had served its purpose, and tried to pull it out. It's still a small plant. Scooped it up in one hand and pulled. Nothing. OK, two hands then.

Jeez! I made absolutely no impression on it at all. Didn't move it one inch, nor did the stem/root show any inclination to break off. I've left it for now till I can get the big spade on it.

The rest of the seeds will be surreptitiously scattered on verges outside the village where they can do battle with the grasses.

edit - or maybe on the front lawn. I've already started converting it to white clover. I wonder if the red would take over and oust the white, or just be companionable and grow alongside?

[cptncrackoff]

Hi two sheds and mothhawk..
I would love to go no dig, I'm just a little uneasy about it looking messy (don't laugh, I'm a bit ocd about clean dirt with no weeds etc) and if it would be troublesome to work a good fine tilth for sowing, for instance..carrots or parsnips!?
Perhaps a little too stuck in my ways!?

[Martin H]

I was planning to go no-dig, but so far I've only achieved no-walk.

I did sow some Winter Tares on one of my beds at the weekend, but I expect I'll end up forking out the plants in spring and chucking them on the compost heap.

I see that Sean (he of the allotment youtube channel, now rebranded Sean's Kitchen Garden on facebook) is going to re-start his allotment from scratch using Dowding's no-dig principles. It'll be interesting to see how he gets on when he starts the videos in September.

[cptncrackoff]

Hi Martin, I have four small raised beds at home which are entirely no dig and they work really well...but the allotment has large beds that I can't really avoid walking on!

[cptncrackoff]

Looking into no dig, I really like the look of it.
Although from what I've read I really need to sort my bindweeed problem before I entertain it!

I used a rotorvator last year, just when I'd pretty much sorted the bind weed....it churned all the remaining roots up and spread them, so now it's back to square one!

[Amandaod]

I'm sorry to high jack this thread but curious - what is green manure? Complete newbie here.