Increase in allotment waiting times

[brooklynodog]

Hate to say it, but allotment rent is so relatively cheap its probably contributing to the amount of folk who rent and dont work the plot?

[bluemoon]

I have asked our council to provide temporary tenancy agreements for 12 months, if they have not done much or anything then they are automatically off - they are considering it

I've just taken on another plot, this time on a private site, and the rules there allow 6 months. If there's no sign of a decent effort being put in then you're off with no rebate on your annual rent. It's something they've just started trying so I don't know if it works yet, either by putting off the work-shy at the start or by quickly getting rid of them later. It has to be worth a try though.
Oh, and before anyone says I shouldn't have taken on another plot when I already have two, my council plots are well cultivated and I've had them since half the site was derelict and waiting lists were just a dream. And the private site had around 15 (derelict) plots going begging last weekend even though there are waiting lists for the nearby council sites. Sorry, I'm not giving up years of hard work to someone who can't be bothered to put a bit of effort in for themselves.

[Eyren]

There seems to be a pattern to the posts here, confirming that there are still plots out there for the asking if you are willing to take on an overgrown one and clear it. Maybe not everywhere, but they are worth seeking out. Moral of the story? Don't just blindly accept whatever the guy at the council tells you about how long it's going to take - go actively looking and you might be lucky

[percy charlie]

i think il consider myself lucky i put my name down on our allotment waiting list around end of may june time was told i was number 15 and the waiting time was around a year to a year and a half but as most were held by old dears as the council women called them there was a chance the waiting time could be a bit shorter. so not expecting much started pot growing. got a call in august, the council had been contacting all overgrown unworked plot holders to see if they really did want to be keeping them on as if so they had 6 months to clean them up or they would take it off them.
they then spoke to all on the waiting list to see who wanted half plots and who wanted whole plots as they where dividing the big plots into 2.
i said i wanted a whole plot and explained what i intended to put in. 2 weeks later i was given one of the small plots which at 242sq feet aint all that small. it was overgrown with weeds and the fench had seen better days but not in that bad of a condition and it had been manured in the winter. so i accepted paid my £10 a year rent and made a start.
as many of you know around this time i found out i was pregnant, had bleeding and didnt know if i would lose the baby, this turned out ok so far as now 35 weeks, however it ment no digging at the lottie so called in to see council and explained but gaurenteed plot would be worked once baby born, they were happy with my reason, renewall came round as didnt get a full year last year they only wanted £5 rent for this year.
i have started to fullfill my guarentee as my friends grand son id digging it all over for me the entire plot and planting my fruit bushes for me for £25 and some strawberry plants for his mum and has even build me a compost box for an extra £10 i supplied the wood, hes only 16 and with no saturday jobs is happy to do for a bit of cash. so after the work he put in today we are 40% done and hes finishing the rest of next tuesday. so not all teenagers are bad, lazy, and glued to the tv there are some really nice ones, and some who will do hard graft for pocket money. hes dug 1/3 of plot and plated 12 bushes plus made the box and he started on the bad section the rest will dig over easy and there is 15 bushed left to plant.
i feel ive been very lucky and 2008 was a good year with 2009 hopefully going to be better.
mr p c hasnt ever seen my lottie as he doesnt do gardening but said when its done he would like to have a look!
something tells me hes afraid il either give him a spade hit with one or plant 6 ft under the lottie somewhere. and why hes not accompanied me before. of to the lottie tomorrow as there is a few bits i plan to do. all the best pc

[stephenwithap]

Could you not give up 1/2 a plot and help someone into being a Allotment holder, they could then move up later and your plot will still be yours... Our local Council have said that there is a caveat in the Allotment act that says you can only have one Allotment space, so they have been very active on reducing 2/3 plot ownership.

the problem is not with the people havin 2to 3 plots and working them why should they give up theirs when they have worked hard on it im not normally a selfish uncaring person but when someone has worked hard to achieve what they have got they shouldnt be asked to give up any of there land that they pay for and waited to obtain
when at the end of the day its some councils to blame
by not acting fast enough on the people who dont work plots when they have them and in some cases dont even pay their rent
i was seven years on a waiting list before i got any where and i took one that was over grown and i worked it and it started looking good till the kids vandalised coz of no security fencing so have now moved to another where i was fortunate enough not to have to wait
but the councils do drag feet
if a plot not bein attended they send a letter then another then a final reminder
for allotments the process takes three months to evict some one now that is down from 12month
then when they do have one spare they get in touch with next on list and they wait for reply if that person dont reply they send another and another now im sorry but i i think they should send one letter given someone 14days to reply by phone email or letter and if not then they give to next person and so on and so forth
those are the things that need to change not people giving up plots that have put so much hard work into
should also be 2strikes of work your plot then out
unless illness prevents this which can happen
also dont forgett that over the last couple of years the amount of people wanting allotments has risen so that will put waiting times up and the councils just dont have enough sites to cover this
but if they changed the way they deal with people who dont run a plot properly then it would ease the burdon slightly
and if they dont want people to have 2 and 3 plots dont give them to them in first place just so they can work them and pass them to someone else who wants a ready made p[lot my thought is if you want it giving to you on a plate and dont want to work it then NO NEED APPLY
steve

[daleclarke]

the problem is not with the people havin 2to 3 plots and working them why should they give up theirs when they have worked hard on it im not normally a selfish uncaring person but when someone has worked hard to achieve what they have got they shouldnt be asked to give up any of there land that they pay for and waited to obtain when at the end of the day its some councils to blame

Stephen I understand your feelings but there is issues here that need to be addressed and talked about.

How do we get more people into allotments and growing their own. I am sorry but issues of multiple plot holdings will come to the fore as the waiting lists increase and now the main tabloids are jumping on the bandwagon.

I know there has been some bitter resentment at people not doing enough or not giving it longer, but they have a right to try and there maybe numerous reasons for the failure rather than just being not bothered, we are becoming guilty of tarring all because of a few.

The landshare scheme is up and running and hopefully that will help a lot as will the NT initiative, (It is about time the RHS did something now) our local council meetings are now tackling the subject more and more and maybe something will happen there.

I because of this thread took it up with my local Councillor and it is an issue because councils are coming under large political and legal pressure for provision, yet do not have the resources to deal with it. As it was put very bluntly to me ask an average person in the street where allotments would be in what they want a council to provide and it would probably be at the bottom of the list as have happened in surveys passed.

So if you have only a small amount of cash in your budget due to demands in people living longer, unemployment etc and you have a large list of people waiting and a large % of people with multiple plots (My Area), what as a council can you do?

Can I ask people with allotments here do your allotments have disabled access or do they have smaller plots for new allotmenteers, do they have a way for people to come down and learn, do you have open days, are they involved with local schools. These are questions councils and government are going to ask now if more money is to be found and I think it will be apparent as more of these politcal movements gain momentum. I do know that especially the disabled access agenda, that this is going to be a big issue.

I will get something straight, I do not have an allotment and I do not need one as i have a small garden that can produce enough for our benefit. Nevertheless, I do feel that allotments should be more community based and open, they should keep proper records made available to all and do more in that community even if it is just a garden club. Of course this comes from experience locally...

Will not go and hide in the bunker as the subject needs a very proper debate!

[faerieprincess]

I really am in two minds over the issue of people having 2 or more plots - part of me thinks "Hey, they're working the plots, good for them" but another part of me thinks "no, this isn't the idea behind allotments, it's not for people to become pretty much self sufficient, but to give people an ability to have a bit of garden space which they otherwise couldn't have."

BUT - until councils manage unused plots properly, then they should leave the multiple plot holders alone. Right now they are just an easy target for people to complain about.

Besides, even moving to a rural area its pretty hard to find a house on a block with a big enough garden to have loads of growing space. The houses are either in the towns on modest blocks, or they are outside the towns on huge acreages - and very little in between.

[Mrs Dobby]

Why is it that we shouldnt be allowed to become self sufficient in veg? We have 2 plots between the 2 of us, both fully worked, both very productive, if we can grow enough to enable us to become almost self sufficient in most veg, then why not? I understand what you're saying about giving folks a bit of garden space that they dont have at home, but in terms of minimising our impact upon the planet, saving food miles and reducing waste and all the pollution involved with the transportation of foodstuffs around the world (not to mention the saving in dwindling fossil fuels by growing locally), then surely doing the best that we can to grow all that we can is the most sound ecological thing we can do?

Believe me, if we could move somewhere where we were able to have enough land to grow all our veg on our own land, then we'd give up the plots without a second thought, but with the prices of property and the ridiculous planning laws, that isnt currently an option without either a lottery win, or breaking planning laws and potentially ending up a criminal!

If more folks want to grow their own, then the council have a duty in law to provide them with an allotment, all it takes is 5 people to band together and go to the council and they have to do something, by law.

If the Govt actually took some notice of how crazy our planning laws are and how many are living in 'land poverty' because a few have all of the resource, and thus allowed those that wanted to to set up their own sustainable permaculture farming communities, living in low impact eco homes that have been built with recycled and local materials, with the understanding that they are 'off grid', self sufficient for water, heating, waste and energy, then perhaps we'd start to see the countries emissions start to reduce to a sustainable level, not to mention reducing our dependance on imported foods and fuel.

[zazen999]

We would have lost many more allotments years ago if those with multiples hadn't taken them on.

[pigletwillie]

Most of our sites in Leicester have waiting lists.

However in 2006 the council SOLD five sites and promised that the £1 million generated would be ploughed back into the remaining plots.

The actual amount raised was considerably more than £1 million, the amount actually spent on allotments was considerably less than £1 million as vast chunks were deducted as "costs", most as very creative accounting me thinks.

So, we have less sites, less plots, bigger waiting lists and a council that did a runner with most of the cash. We got a grant of £5k as our share of the windfall and are buying a composting loo with it.

As for disabled access, we are assisting one plot holder with a wheelchair bound daughter by building raised beds and laying paving, this will hopefully help with getting further grants and expanding this.

As for more plots, councils just want to sell them. Ours is worth £5 million and they would do anything to get it.

[jacob marley]

We would have lost many more allotments years ago if those with multiples hadn't taken them on.

On our site there are 6 of us with 2 plot's each i used to have 3 plot's but gave 1 up last september because we got a waiting list .
As zazen say's without us they probably would not have so many site's we have 85 plot's on our site 80% well worked the other's summer gardener's and not so good but they are trying very trying....jacob

[Peter]

I really am in two minds over the issue of people having 2 or more plots - part of me thinks "Hey, they're working the plots, good for them" but another part of me thinks "no, this isn't the idea behind allotments, it's not for people to become pretty much self sufficient, but to give people an ability to have a bit of garden space which they otherwise couldn't have.".....

With respect, you are completely wrong about the idea.

The idea was to allow normal folk to grow enough veg to support an average family, that is why the standard plot size is ten rods.

Add in soft fruit and some exotic stuff, then things are getting crowded for the enthusiastic.
Ad in a vegetarian or two with a freezer or two and time to spare........

You do have a point about more than one full sized plot, but if the site would have been lost without double plotters, then their reward is to keep the double plots until they see fit to give some up.
I suspect that point will be when every plot on the site is well cultivated.

Having two full plots myself and having given up a further 1/3rd sized plot I found myself very annoyed with one half of the sharers who took on the 1/3rd, as their 1/6th degenerated into weeds to waist height while the other 1/6th got better than I had it.

One new tenant on my site has, from September, dug over and weeded a 5 rod plot completely. Another tenant of some nine months longer tenancy has not been seen on site since midsummer and he lives about a 1/4 mile from the gate on the same road.

[bluemoon]

If we stick with the true spirit of the first allotments act, I believe plots were for the 'labouring poor' as a way to feed their families. So from the very beginning they were seen as a means towards self sufficiency. I assume the wording has been changed since then so that anyone who wants to can apply for one, but I don't believe that the spirit of self sufficiency which lay behind it has changed so much. I agree with every word Mrs Dobby wrote, what was once a way for the disadvantaged to eat well is now the means by which many of us lead the most environmentally aware lives that we possibly can and until the laws of the land change dramatically it will remain the only way open to us. Those first allotments were actually a way of pacifying the poor in the face of the enclosures act. The fact is that all these years later those of us who wish to grow healthy food for our families are still fighting a similar battle against restrictive land laws and allotments remain the only option.

[plotman]

I got my plot in wiltshire two yrs ago. I was on list for 15 months and wwas still 16th. I called into council and suggested i might die before i get a plot ( only 55 lol) No reaction. I took it upon myself to photograph every allotment in my town that was being neglected. By neglected i mean 3 ft high grass. I took down the plot no. and gave my findings to the council. I continued to do this EVERY WEEK for 6 months. It was digital so cost me peanuts. However sad i seemed , every week i delivered an update and demanded to know why the council, as landlords, were not carrying out there duty of care. Eventually the submitted and offered me my allotment on the express understanding that i didnt frequent the council offices any more. Cue jumping.....I guess so. But my actions have now ensured the council have NO neglected allotments at all in Melksham. Full credit to our council, They listened (eventually lol) and reacted positively

[plotman]

I take on board yr comments regarding the work you put in initially, and absolutely support you in holding on to both plots being you keep them both up together.Councils should concentrate on ensuring allotments are used properly. And secondly they should actively look for new additional sites. BUT, and a big BUT lol. Your comments about you having one and yr partner the other dont wash lol. You ARE multi plot owners. Plots were designed for families, Not individuals. Yr comment is what i d expect from the council lol not one of us plot holders. Hang on to them both, you work them and have every right