Old apple trees

[AndrewD]

I have 2 trees, both were in the garden when I bought the house, so I have no idea what variety they are. How can I identify them?

The older tree has strange growths on the branches, see attached picture, (click on it to see it better). Can anyone tell me what it is? Is it a disease or something that I should worry about? The tree has a large crop of apples every year, so it doesn't appear to be a problem other than making the tree look hideous.

[Nicos]

Looks like canker

Google Image Result for http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/bc/Apple_tree_with_canker.jpg/800px-Apple_tree_with_canker.jpg

Not quite sure what to do with it though- someone a bit wiser than me will be along shortly!
I think I'd be tempted to leave well alone as it's producing so much fruit- but I bet you are supposed to cut it back and spray it with something!

Maybe now is a time to plant a new one anyway to eventually replace the older one?

Old apple trees are getting very rare these days which is such a shame.

No idea how to ID it though...photo of the fruit and send it somewhere???
There are a lot of 'lost' varieties, and you just might make someone's day!!

Welcome to the Vine AndrewD !!!

-are you growing veg too??

[Flummery]

Some places have 'apple days' - usually October, where you can take an apple and a bit of branch along for ID. You can google apple day for details but you 'll need to wait till this autumn.

[Becca]

That's definatly canker.. the 3 old trees on my new allotment are apparently riddled with it to the extent that the expert told me to chop them down and start again, quite depressing given I'd picked that (otherwise incredibly overgrown plot) because I wanted those trees.. needless to say I've ignored the chop em down and start again advice and am trying to prolong their life by carefully pruning off the worst bits and see how I get on.. when pruning good hygene is all important.. get a bottle of meths and wipe down the blades of the saw/loppers/secretars with it after every cut to avoid spreading the disease to uninfected bits it's a bacteria disease and gets in at small wounds causing the growth you see. It then spreads through the trees circulatory system to infect the rest of the tree.. infected wood can be identified as it has a dark brown patch inside rather than the usual reddy goldy colour.. If the infection is minimal you should be able to get rid of it by chopping away cankerous pieces till you that dark brown patch is gone. However if it's as bad as mine the best you can probably do is remove the worst bits and enjoy the apples as ill trees will fruit prolifically as they're stressed and want to ensure the next generation.. My plan is to try and keep the trees I have for as long as possible and in the meantime plant a couple of new ones at the other end of the plot so when they do eventually keel over (mine have survived under brambles for the last few years so it's no wonder they're ill) I have some happy established trees to replace them The impression I got is that extensive canker will eventually prove fatal but it's a slow process so you might as well enjoy them in the meantime.. hope that's helpful, Becca

[Becca]

oh, and this website was a list of apple days throughout the country last year but having just looked at it they're waiting for the new info but it might be worth bookmarking it and checking it later in the year

Apple Day Events

[rustylady]

Trees don't have to be beautiful to produce good fruit. I have a huge old apple tree in my (rented) back garden. It has obviously been cut back at various times (but just lopped at the wrong time) but it still bears a massive crop of huge cooking apples every year. I am trying to tame it a bit by selective cutting out during late summer so as not to encourage it to make lots of new growth. As yours appears to have canker and the shoot will eventually die anyway, I would cut back to healthy wood behind the canker growth. If really worried consult a tree surgeon or do some investigation online re fruit tree pruning. It's quite complicated!!!

[TPeers]

I don't think it is canker - the growth pattern is wrong, the wood isn't cracked. Try crown gall. Usually affects young trees and is associated with prolonged waterlogged conditions.

Did the previous owners put in a drainage system?

[andrewo]

If in doubt, wait a season and see what apples you get off it. Are they healthy? Do they taste good? I'd spray the tree with bordeaux mix in water to kill off any fungus in early spring.

If the tree isn't producing then cut back the branches with the canker/crown gall to uninfected growth and burn the infected branches.

Just watch it and plant a new one about 15 feet away as a companion. Try a quince, which will help pollinate the apple.

[Rossytay1]

I think it is burrknot, and is not canker. Some old apple varieties naturally grow like this. You can cut the stem and, if stuck in the ground, will root on its own.
Sometimes it is seen as a problem, so try this webpage:
Growing Small Farms: Burr Knot in Apple

Canker generally causes 'dips' in the branch.

For variety identification, you may have local experts which you can find via local fruit nurseries, the National Trust etc (we have some great people up here in Cumbria). Alternatively, send 3 or 4 apples to the Royal Horticultural Society's identification service which costs about £9. You can also have them genetically identified for about £100!

For any trees with canker - and at any time when pruning trees - always clean/disinfect secateurs so you do not spread it around.

[AndrewD]

Thanks for all your comments and sorry it’s taken so long to reply.

There has been 3 suggestions; Canker, Crown Gall, and Burr Knot. I have looked at each and searched the net for pictures and I can’t find anything that looks quite like my problem. I don’t have any thinning of branches, which seems to be a common symptom with all 3 suggestions. Crown Gall is an interesting suggestion, with the reference to waterlogged soil. I have not seen the ground waterlogged, but historically the locality is very wet. In King John’s day each of the local villages were islands and travel between them was by boat. Much of the surrounding countryside is peat moors or bogs. Our street name contains the word Slack, and Slack is a Viking word meaning low lying boggy ground.

I intend to prune the tree as the branches are 2 dense and it’s difficult to get into the tree for apple picking. The height of the tree is easily equal to the house and even with a ladder, I can’t get to the very top. But as for pruning out affected branches, I’m afraid the problem is evident on the main trunk as low as 4 feet from the ground. So to cut it out would virtually mean cutting the tree down. I think all I will do is some pruning to manage the shape of the tree and leave it at that for now. I have a lot of trouble with apples rotting on the tree, so I think there is another problem with it as well.

For anyone who is interested in pruning apple trees, I have found 10 short video guides on YouTube by stephenhayesuk, an apple grower. You should check them out, they are quite good.

Thanks every again, Andrew

[bigal123_123]

I would'nt worry it looks like burr knot sorry im an arborist see it alot in old breeds just enjoy the fruit dont prune to hard good luck,

[bobleponge]

Old apple trees

Sorry for muscling in slightly on the thread but I also have old apple trees in my garden. None of them currently give me cause for concern but the biggest one only gives apples every other year. Any ideas why this should be.
I'm afraid I have no idea of the type of apple, but they are eaters, and its the only one of its type. The other half dozen or so are all different shapes and sizes,not one of them looking or tasting like another.
All help as always happily received.

[southlondongardener]

Royal Horticultural Society - Gardening Advice: Bienniel Fruit Bearing

Biennial bearing occurs when apples have 'on' years, with abundant crops, and 'off' years when little is gathered. Some apples, 'Laxton's Superb' and 'Beauty of Bath' for example, do this naturally, while others are tipped into this mode by a frosty spring for example, when no blossom is pollinated.

Without a crop to support, the trees use their resources to produce flower buds leading to tremendous blossom the following year. The resulting heavy crop reduces the trees resources, so that little blossom is made for the following year.

It appears that flower initiation for the following year occurs when shoot growth is finished and leaves are mature. The seeds within developing fruit seem to inhibit flower bud initiation, and most of the inhibition takes place in the first few weeks after pollination.

Sometimes poor pruning, where insufficient new growth is encouraged and too much older flower-bearing wood is retained, can cause this.

Thinning the blossom, removing nine out of 10 flower clusters, without removing any foliage, can help. With big trees only some branches need to be treated. However permanently modifying cropping patterns from biennial to annual bearing might take several years of blossom thinning.

[bobleponge]

SLG you are a star.
Clearly my problem is that I have never pruned it. I dont know how to, so I am going to have to start reading voraciously.
I will be back home on 29th Feb, does anyone know if that will be too late for this year, although, fortunately, this year will be a cropping year.

[bobleponge]

Hmmmm

Or of course, I may have one of the aforementioned varieties and then even if I pruned for the rest of my natural it would still only give me pommes every 2 years.
Will now have to try and identify the breed