Root Bags and Allotments

[muckdiva]

I don't think we are allowed to plant trees on our allotments, but I have 4 cherry trees which would be better off up there than in the garden. I'm sure I've read in GYO that you can plant trees in root bags which makes them 'non permanent' . Anyone ever tried these?

[ChocClare]

I've just ordered two - one for a fig which I'm planting next to the house and it will like to be constrained (plus I might want to move it!) and the other for a walnut that I've just bought, which I do not want to grow to however high they grow to. All the blurb on the net implies that they do control the size and that the trees are therefore moveable - however, the root bags still allow things to grow quite big, I understand (I think it depends on the size of the root bag), so you'd probably have to be quite hefty to move it even with the root bag

[Protea]

I've just ordered two - one for a fig which I'm planting next to the house and it will like to be constrained (plus I might want to move it!) and the other for a walnut that I've just bought, which I do not want to grow to however high they grow to. All the blurb on the net implies that they do control the size and that the trees are therefore moveable - however, the root bags still allow things to grow quite big, I understand (I think it depends on the size of the root bag), so you'd probably have to be quite hefty to move it even with the root bag

I'm looking to put my 2yr old minarete apples into root bags from their pots (which aren't ideal really), where did you get your root bags from?

[SarzWix]

Just the question I was going to ask! I've found 'Root Barrier' fabric stuff on Haxnicks website Haxnicks Direct :: Our Products :: The Very Best in Plant Protection but I can't find the bags


Edit; found them on the Ken Muir site .: Ken Muir :.
£5.95 each, just put 'Root Control' into the search box.

Anyone know of a cheaper source?

[muckdiva]

Just the question I was going to ask! I've found 'Root Barrier' fabric stuff on Haxnicks website Haxnicks Direct :: Our Products :: The Very Best in Plant Protection but I can't find the bags


Edit; found them on the Ken Muir site .: Ken Muir :.
£5.95 each, just put 'Root Control' into the search box.

Anyone know of a cheaper source?

Wow, thanks for that Sarswix, I was going to order some for £12 each, but hand't got round to it - Ken Muir's are a great saving!

[smallblueplanet]

If they've got no roots what stops them falling over?

[Paul Wagland]

This was one of my projects for 'The Allotment Gardener' a few months back.

I have two plots on one allotment site and I use one as an 'orchard' plot by planting trees in root bags (from Harrod Horticultural). To be honest I don't think this will actually stop them from putting down roots. In fact I've just moved a blueberry bush (which was in a bag to maintain an area of ericaceous soil) and it was throwing roots out in every direction, right through the fabric!

So what's the point? The purpose of the root bags, in reality, is to make the trees look like they are temporary. Nobody has made a fuss about what I'm doing in two years, but if they do I can just say 'look, they're all in root bags dear chap. At the merest whim I could whip them out of the soil and away'. I also keep the trees small by pruning every autumn and spring.

Truth be told, lifting the tree, soil and bag out of the ground would take more strength than I'm ever likely to have! If I ever have to leave the plot and I can't find a willing tenant (15 healthy fruit trees? can't see that happening!) then I will fell the trees for firewood - they were only a few quid from Wilkos and Aldi anyway!

If you want to be more cautious you can also buy root barrier - which usually comes on a roll and is much tougher, more like flexible plastic board. I don't think it's very water-permeable but you can create an effective underground 'wall' around the outside of the planting hole.

Allotment stewards are also generally very tolerant of trees grown as espaliers, cordons etc - probably because they are impressed more than anything else!

[Protea]

Hmmm, thanks for that Paul. I wanted to plant them in bags as they're not doing too well in thier large pots at the moment (can't get the stake to stay upright so one of them is at a rather jaunty angle!). I think they'd do better in the ground, but the house i'm moving to (read: new allotment at home!) we'll only be in for a couple of years before needing to move again, so i'd hoped to be able to take the trees with me.

From what you say it sounds like i'm unlikely to be able to get them out of the ground again?

[muckdiva]

if they do I can just say 'look, they're all in root bags dear chap. At the merest whim I could whip them out of the soil and away'.

That's all I really need, thanks for the tip Paul.

[Paul Wagland]

From what you say it sounds like i'm unlikely to be able to get them out of the ground again?

You will be able to transplant the trees I think, but it's not likely you can lift the bag and rootball out together in one go, ready to be moved to a new home. It'll simply be too heavy. Unless you have a team of strong friends maybe? Even then I doubt the material of the root bag would take the strain.

My plan would be to just lift them gently with a fork as you would normally, cleanly chopping off any roots that have grown through the bag. At least the soil / compost inside the bag won't be compacted. After just a couple of years I'd say they'll come out easily enough.

[Paul Wagland]

H(can't get the stake to stay upright so one of them is at a rather jaunty angle!)

By the way, don't bother putting a stake down inside the planting bag. The compost isn't compacted enough to hold it securely. Use a stake either side of the tree, 15-20cm outside the bag, with a batten fixed between them and the tree tied to the batten. I'll try and get up to the lottie tomorrow to take a pic for you.

[Snadger]

I had potted some trees and bushes up last year because I didn't know exactly where they were going to finish up and I hadn't prepared the ground for them!
They were in large pots but kept getting blown over and I was also worried about the frost freezing the rootball. I buried the pots upt to there neck in a sheltered part of the allotment and only dug the pots up recently to plant the hard fruit and soft fruit in there final positions.
They had a lovely rootball which transpalnted easily.

My point is, and this is purely theoretical, why can't the trees be planted in large plastic pots and sunk into the ground instead of using planting bags? OK the plant can't send it's roots sideways, but if you want to dig them up in the future that wont matter! When you want to lift them, just dig down and sever any taproots coming from the bottom of the pot and lift it out intact with a perfectly formed rootball!
This would only work short term, say five years or so I would imagine.

Another way of transplanting large soil grown trees is to dig a trench around the tree well back from the trunk and leave it for a year without lifting the tree. This will force the tree to form adventitious roots and it can be lifted the following autumn by cutting across the bottom of the rootball!

[muckdiva]

My point is, and this is purely theoretical, why can't the trees be planted in large plastic pots and sunk into the ground instead of using planting bags?

I wondered that myself Snadger, but does that mean you have to remember to water the trees all the time.... I guess terracotta pots would let some moisture through, but what about plastic...?

[Snadger]

I wondered that myself Snadger, but does that mean you have to remember to water the trees all the time.... I guess terracotta pots would let some moisture through, but what about plastic...?

They wil need watering occasionally but if you put a good water retaining mulch of FYM around them they won't need any more watering than soil grown specimens!
Just remember, their roots WILL still come out the drainage holes in the bottom of the pots to search for water and the subsoil is usually permanently moist!

[SarzWix]

By the way, don't bother putting a stake down inside the planting bag. The compost isn't compacted enough to hold it securely. Use a stake either side of the tree, 15-20cm outside the bag, with a batten fixed between them and the tree tied to the batten. I'll try and get up to the lottie tomorrow to take a pic for you.

They were in large pots but kept getting blown over and I was also worried about the frost freezing the rootball. I buried the pots up to their neck in a sheltered part of the allotment ...
My point is, and this is purely theoretical, why can't the trees be planted in large plastic pots and sunk into the ground instead of using planting bags? OK the plant can't send it's roots sideways, but if you want to dig them up in the future that wont matter!

Both of these sound like great ideas! I've already got 3 trees in quite large containers, filled with sterile topsoil mixed with a bit of compost & FYM, but even then they're a bit unstable. I think I'm going to adopt both of these ideas! Burying the pots should reduce watering as they will be kept cooler in the ground, I would think?
I'll save the root control stuff for the blackberries I've still got to plant