Deep frosts

[Brengirl]

Soft fruit trees......can they be damaged from a hard frost even tho they are fleeced. Or is it only fruit production that is damaged by blossom frost.

[RedThorn]

I believe it's the new buds and flowers that are affected when they start to open and grow in spring. Hopefully someone will come along and either affirm what I've said or prove me wrong as I've not much experience with fruit trees

[snuffer]

I have green-gauge, plum, apple, pear and walnut trees. I never give them any protection from frost or snow except in the spring. A late spring frost can badly affect fruit production.

Not sure if this is the right thing to do according to the text books but it works for me.

[Nicos]

To be honest , I think it depends on how cold you're talking about. When you think of climate zones in USA and which plants are recommended for each one, then you'll see that water fall, max and min temp come into survival of the plant.
Obviously if a plant is in a tub , then the roots are more likely to be damaged by the frosts.
We had -14C last winter and all my soft fruit trees were fine.
Not being a fruit Guru, I wonder why you'd fleece a dormant fruit tree during the winter as I'd have thought it's the emerging buds/flowers which suffer in the Spring which would need protecting.
An interesting thread...I'll keep my eye on it for more advice!

[sarraceniac]

I have 20+ fruit trees. The only thing I am worried about is a frost on the blossom. The guy on here to answer this is FB who is the fruit tree expert. (Some grapes may not realise it, but he is). Personally I've never lost a tree to frost. Various types of Apple, Pear, Plum, Cherry, Apricot, Peach, Quince, Medlar. But I've lost loads of fruit to frost.

[Brengirl]

Just what I needed to know. I had a maiden peach last year and her very first effort was frostbitten. This winter I have persuaded her to hug a housewall. As she is my baby I want to keep he cosy during the winter so have fleeced From what I have learned I am a molly coddler and she would be OK until bud formation.

[FB.]

Thanks for the kind words, sarraceniac.

Regarding trees; yes, death due to frost is very rare, but is possible in extremely cold parts of the UK, or with shallow-rooted/dwarf or container trees.

A dormant tree is usually safe from harm because the dormancy is intended to protect them from winter. A growing tree is easily damaged by frost and the delicate blossoms are particularly vulnerable. Sometimes, deep freezes just before blossom time can kill blossom buds just as they're swelling, prior to opening.

Apart from fleece, you could try hanging some Christmas lights in your tree, if the blossoms are opening and a frost is imminent. The heat from the bulbs may be enough to prevent the blossoms freezing.

If you wrap the tree up too much, it will think that spring has come early and will flower and leaf out early, increasing the risk of the tree being active when a late frost arrives. My two Brownlees Russet apples are still in full leaf, but with this recent cold weather, they're probably going to suffer some damage that will affect either fruiting or vigour next year. I woudn't be surprised if they have lost many of next year's blossom buds, because the trees are not at all ready for winter.
But.......I'm not going to try to protect them. If they fail to perform, they will be re-grafted, or removed and replaced. There's no point fighting a losing battle.

For more delicate plants in movable containers, I would keep them on the South side of the house during December-January, to give a slower descent into dormancy in December and little extra winter protection in the cold of January. I would then move them to the shadier and cooler side of the house once the milder weather starts to arrive in February, to try to slow down their development as much as possible and delay flowering as long as possible. Once bud break is inevitable, you'll have to move them to the warmer side of the house again, to keep them as warm and sunny as possible.

[krazy_krok]

FB your advice is always so detailed and easy to understand just hope I can advise you some time in the future to show thanks for your many hints and tips.
cheers
KK

[FB.]

Regarding trees; yes, death due to frost is very rare, but is possible in extremely cold parts of the UK, or with shallow-rooted/dwarf or container trees.

Hmmm....famous last words.

I took a walk around my fruit trees earlier today and noticed that this prolonged cold spell has caused the bark on the trunk of my Victoria plum to severely split in several places. Although she'll probably survive a few more years, I think that she'll eventually die from complications of the wounds.

Oh well.

.

[sarraceniac]

I think we've got a weirdo winter. For most things I just put my plants in and they are OK. My own 'speciality' is semi tropicals. I've obviously lost a few over the years in semi-tropical Scarborough but for the first time, this year, I am worried. Last year we had a nasty spell in mid-February but if it happens at that time of year then you know it can't last too long. My Arundo donax was not too happy and was a washout this year but still alive, I lost two of my 6 year old palms. Never any problem before 2008/9 but I think we have real probs this year . My (fleeced) tree fern is looking sicker than ever before.

My second love is my fruit. (Which brings us back to this thread). I'm not an expert on it but you may just well see a grown (no, old) man cry if it continues like this. I am a scientist by training so I still believe in global warming but I think we have one hell of a blip this year.

[FB.]

I can remember the winters of the early-mid 1980's being quite cold. We had winters with temperatures regularly dropping between -5'C to -10'C.
I used to keep basic weather record and charts of my own. They proved very useful for timing of things in the spring.

Then, in the very late 1980's, around the time that *Chern0byl* had a meltdown, the Cambs climate started a steady period of warming that peaked in summer 2003, with record-breaking temperatures. In most years of the late 1990's, almost all the frosts were only dropping just a degree or two below freezing.
I can even remember walking in the Cambs countryside in a T-shirt in late February 1998, with temperatures in the high teens.

Since 2003, Cambs has endured duller and cooler summers, with large numbers of light rain showers (which encourage fungus attacks on plants).
The summer of 2008 was our dullest and coolest on record. The winter of 2008-2009 also had early frosts and was followed by a period of prolonged heavy snow in late January and early February.
This winter seemed to start OK, with no frosts here until recent days. But we've certainly got a big chill now.

I am also a scientist and I don't doubt that global warming is real, but I think that some of it is being attributed to normal cycles in climate that seem to last for many years. Even the hurricane seasons in the USA tend to run in cycles, where they get bad one's for a few years and then nothing for several years.
There has even been speculation that the smog of 100-200 years ago blocked out the sunlight, causing global cooling and that many of today's comparisons are with an unusually cool period of time.

When I planted my apple trees, I made sure that I covered all kinds of eventualities, so that I shouldn't have all trees having a bad year at the same time.
I have varieties that thrive in warm climates, and others that thrive in cold climates. I have some on rootstocks that thrive in cool and damp, while others have rootstocks tolerant of heat and drought. I have some apple trees with strong resistance to diseases of wet areas and some with strong resistance to diseases of dry areas.
I would advise others to choose their fruit and veg to cover a broad range of weather conditions, so that a total crop failure is much less likely.

Anyway, I've wandered off-topic with my waffling.

[Brengirl]

Wow I have had some great advice Oh Knowledgeable Ones.

I wrapped an ornamental lemon tree in fleece. It was full of developing fruit at the time. I had a peek yesterday and they are still there and even seem to be changing colour. I have also got a christmas illumination (reindeer and sled) in the garden and a few rope lights. I didn't know where to hang them so spiraled them around the lemon, more for effect than frost protection. We have had some severe frosts and are continuing to do so and I will be very sad if I lose my bougainvillea.

[sarraceniac]

I take it that your Bougainvillea is under glass for the winter Bren? They don't like below 5oC so even fleecing in beautiful Dorset may not be enough, although you have more chance than me, though I'm right on the coast so have mild winters compared to a few miles inland from here. The main thing is don't over-water it. They need next to no water in winter when dormant and over watering is the surest way to lose it.

[Brengirl]

I take it that your Bougainvillea is under glass for the winter Bren? They don't like below 5oC so even fleecing in beautiful Dorset may not be enough, although you have more chance than me, though I'm right on the coast so have mild winters compared to a few miles inland from here. The main thing is don't over-water it. They need next to no water in winter when dormant and over watering is the surest way to lose it.

Oh dear. Methinks I must have lost them. I have 4. They are all in containers and trained up trellis on the pergola. There is no way I could have moved them under glass. Any damage will most certainly have been done by now so back to the drawing board. If the wood still seems green perhaps I could try taking cuttings and put them under glass?

[sarraceniac]

If the wood still seems green perhaps I could try taking cuttings and put them under glass?

I would certainly try that if you can. You may just get lucky anyway but any type of insurance is better than none. Bougs are gorgeous (and expensive to lose).