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Redlove Apples "Era"

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  • #16
    Out of curiosity, it appears quite a lot of the orchards shown in the link that HayWayne posted were M9 based - why would they choose this over something more like M26? I gather they'd spray against pests/disease, but other than being the right height for picking I can't see why they don't go for something that'll give them more yield?

    digon - great I'll drop you an email in spring to see how they did if you don't mind

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    • #17
      M9 produces more fruit and better quality fruit at an earlier age than M26 in commercial situations where trees are grown in clear ground, drip-fed and drip-irrigated and don't have to fight-off pests or diseases because they are treated with chemicals.
      MM106 also produces good fruit (better quality than M26), but in good soil and with steady moisture (but not saturated soil) it will become too vigorous and not fruit well.

      In good conditions, MM106 is an equal in vigour to MM111. It's when the conditions are less-than-ideal that MM106 really falters; it has a very variable response to growing conditions - it is even possible for M26 trees to outgrow MM106 trees in certain difficult situations.

      Home growers have a very different situation to commercial orchards;
      Soil is usually nowhere near as good as the carefully-selected orchard sites.
      Natural rainfall is less predictable than timed irrigation runs. Soil may not retain moisture was well as orchard soil or may retain too much moisture and remain cold and heavy.
      Pests and diseases can take a lot of the vigour out as they munch the leaves (the tree solar panels) and suck the sap (the tree blood).

      I understand that organic growers opt for MM106 so as to have a bit more strength in reserve due to less spray options (but still able to irrigate/feed), while non-organic tend to opt for M9 because they can eliminate pests and diseases which could otherwise stunt the tree.

      .

      If you have the time and inclination to spray, feed and water, M9 fruit is superior to M26, while MM106 fruit is superior to MM111.

      Home growers, with trees left to fend for themselves have a trade-off to make, where lower fruit yield or quality is acceptable, so as to gain a more rugged tree which doesn't get sick at the first challenge from nature.
      .

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      • #18
        Originally posted by FB. View Post
        If you must persist with M9, you could try digging-out a large and deep area, replacing half the topsoil with a mixture of well-rotted manure and compost.

        If you plan to try with M9 (I think that you'll be lucky to get the arms of the espalier more than 3ft in each direction no matter what you do) then I suggest a good mulch with rotted manure late each winter and maybe a second mulch later in the season. You could also consider using fish, blood and bone fertiliser immediately prior to manuring.
        Is that to a specific depth? From your post, it appears the M9 needs the best start in order to perform to it's best ability - should I dig 1.5m? 1.5m-1.0m rotted manure, 1.0m-0m compost? Or some other depth? 2m deep?

        Once I've dug the hole, should I apply the fish, blood and bone fertiliser then fill it in with manure, then compost? Or sprinkle it around the edge?

        Due to the little/no wind, will it need a stake? As mentioned previously, I was going to simply allow it to grow vertically unattended then attach the arms to the horizontal wires.

        Also, when would you advise doing this work? The tree is due to be delivered in 27 days.
        Garden Chris

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        • #19
          The depth to dig-in some compost and manure will depend on how deep you can go.
          You may be horrified to find a layer of rock, gravel, clay, chalk or some nasty surprise such as a big utility pipe only a few inches below the surface.
          I suggest go out and dig a as soon as possible to see what lies beneath the topsoil and how deep is your topsoil. You might have quite chalky soil, in which case you'll need a very strong rootstock just for it to be able to cling on for dear life in such a high-pH hostile soil. You may have quite a clay soil, in which case the acidic compost and manure may need a little lime to prevent the pH going too low.

          For the very best start, you ought to go about 18 inches down (about two spade depths) and out as far as you plan to have the spread of the tree. This could be an oval shape basically covering an area under where the branches will be.

          Remove half of the topsoil and replace with a mixture of well-rotted manure and well-rotted compost. Sprinkle some fish, blood and bone in the upper layers a few inches below the surface.
          Use of manure or compost may drop the pH too far, depending on the type of soil which you have.

          If the tree will be tied to wires in a calm location, you probably won't need to staked.

          It will be very important not to let it fruit too early in life, because this dramatically slows the growth of shoots and roots; M9 is so keen to channel all energy into fruit (and none into growth) that it has apparently been known to sacrifice itself to complete development of its fruit!

          Get the ground prepared as soon as possible in advance of the trees arrival and plant the tree as soon as convenient after it arrives.
          .

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          • #20
            I still think that you're doing a lot of work for something which may not succeed.
            If the tree was on a stronger rootstock such as MM111 or M25, you could just chuck it in a hole, shovel the soil back over it and let it get on with it - no need for special preparation in advance, no need for feeding and only a little watering needed during dry spells in its first season after planting.
            Chances are that a strong-rooted tree would, if properly managed, also be able to fruit sooner and heavier than a dwarf.
            .

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            • #21
              Sadly I have no choice over the rootstock, it's sent by Suttons (they're the only suppliers). It doesn't directly state "Era" (the variety I've purchased) is on M9, yet it does state "Selinia" is (they're from the same breeder, the only difference being when the fruit is ready in the season early/mid/late). I just drew the conclusion that it was the same given the final dimensions on the site match for both varieties. Perhaps I'm wrong?

              Thanks for the help FB, if you've got any other tips - don't hesitate to post them. I'm an avid reader and can read at great lengths upon a topic of interest. What you're saying sinks in

              I'm going to prepare the ground this weekend, giving roughly 20/24 days before the tree arives - I should hope enough time.
              Garden Chris

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