Mystery Apple

[FB.]

Yesterday I paid a visit to a very old apple tree which I've known about for years.

Pictures will follow shortly, but here are some of my observations:

Fruit ripens late September-Early October most years, and is likely to be ripe about a week later this year.
Some fruit has already begun to drop.
The fruits are mostly around 6cm (2.5 inches), varying by 1cm (0.5 inches).
I would describe them as:
"Cooking apple" but would make a dual-purpose/sharp eating apple for some people.
Fairly tough skin.
Crisp flesh.
Acidic flesh which browns quickly when cut.
Seems to bruise fairly easily.
Probably quite high vitamin C content judging by the taste.
No bitter pit despite a summer drought and no feeding.
Immune to codling moth.
Immune to sawfly.
Immune to woolly aphids.
Immune to mildew.
Immune to scab.
Partial resistance to canker.
Very biennial.
Probably diploid judging by the mid-green elongated leaves and large plump pips in the fruit.
Possibly very old tree - the current tree is a regeneration from the lower trunk of a tree which had a 40cm (16 inch) diameter trunk that had gone hollow and got blown over in a storm some years ago. The tree regrew from the ring of living wood that had formed the hollow base of the trunk.
Vigorous "T3" tree.

Pictures of the fruit coming shortly.

[FB.]

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[FB.]

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[Glutton4...]

Hmmmm delish!

Now bearing in mind I know next to nothing at all about apples, I'd say definitely a 'cooker' from the skin, but the flesh looks very pale, like an 'eater.'

But, like I said, I know nothing.

[swaine]

intresting any idea if its a wild seedling/ discarded core seedling or a tree part of an old garden/orchard, im just getting interested in apples ,I am amazed by the amount of roadside apple trees with fruit on that can be found when looked out for, im hoping to get out and get pictures of some next weekend

[FB.]

Hi Swaine.

Most likely it is a relic from an old orchard of the early 1900s. It is only a couple of miles from the old Chivers site which was famous for fruit production in the 1900s and sits on land which almost certainly grew apples in the past.

Given that it broke off a few inches above ground some years ago and re-sprouted, it's possible that the fruit is that of a seedling rootstock or a clonal rootstock.
It might also have been a trial variety that was never released. The long stalk is reminiscent of the 1900s apples where it made it easier to get sprays all over the fruit, unlike many really old varieties which have the fruit tight to the stem.

To me, it has some resemblance to Golden Noble, Edward VII, Warner's King or Winter Majetin, but I don't think it's any of those four because there are other features which disagree (such as ripening time being too early or the stalk being too long and slender).

I genuinely don't know what it is.

[FB.]

What really appeals to me about this tree is:

1. It is very old.
2. It managed to come back to life after catastrophic damage.
3. It is very healthy - resisting all known apple pests and diseases - despite total neglect.
4. The fruit is of acceptable size and usable quality.


Watch out, Bardsey apple! The Cambridgeshire Centurion's coming after you.

[Glutton4...]

Best you get grafting then, FB!

[Kirk]

Add pictures of the leaves and anything else and send the information off to Brogdale. They say they will try and identify an apple and they are also interested in old varieties, if they suspect they do not have it then they would likely ask for a few sections to grow on and keep.

Bit far to head down to, Faversham, but they have an Apple Day usually sometime in Oct.

[Vince G]

Would be great to see a picture of the tree.

My bet would be on a boring old Bramley I'm afraid. They are that vivid green with the occasional flush of red and have quite pale flesh. I should know, got 6 sacks of the buggers in the garage ready for cider production!!

[boundtothesoil]

Would be great to see a picture of the tree.

My bet would be on a boring old Bramley I'm afraid.

I agree that it has some of Bramley's charactersitics, but I don't think that the long stalk is one of them. This particular trait is more James Grieve-like.

[FB.]

Would be great to see a picture of the tree.

My bet would be on a boring old Bramley I'm afraid. They are that vivid green with the occasional flush of red and have quite pale flesh. I should know, got 6 sacks of the buggers in the garage ready for cider production!!

The fruit is quite small for Bramley and it's unusual round here for Bramley not to suffer from woolly aphids and scab. Also the leaves seem too pale, too thin and too elongated. Plus the fruit bruises very easily and contains plenty of large plump pips.

The tree itself has no recognisable features because of the way it has re-grown as a multi-stemmed bushy tree like a coppiced hazel - regrowing from near the ground after the hollow main trunk snapped off some years ago.

[FB.]

Update.

It's definitely not Bramley. The fruit doesn't have enough orange striping and the stalk is too long and slender compared to other Bramleys. The leaves are not thick and dark - and it has reasonable numbers of healthy-looking pips suggesting it's diploid.

It's probably not James Grieve. The fruit is quite late and lacking in colour for JG. Although the fruits bruise fairly easily they seem crisper than JG.

I don't think it's going to be easy to put a name to it. It might even be a seedling rootstock (perhaps seedling from Golden Delicious, Grimes Golden or Antonovka).