Plum Trees

[vicpivo]

Hi All - I've recently dug up some small plum trees (1-2 yrs old) that have grown from seed in my in-laws garden. No idea what variety they are - I'll have to work it out in the summer when it fruits.

Anyway... I have potted the trees (they are 2-3 foot tall) and added some root hormone powder to get it going. Once I've dug the allotment I can put it in it's permanent residence.

The parent tree is 15 yrs old (ish) and is about 8 foot tall. I want to keep the tree around 6 foot so it doesn't block out the light and the roots interfere with my vege's.

Does anyone have any advice on how I can get the tree to start fruiting slightly earlier in it's maturity to stunt it's growth?

Any expert advice would be greatly appreciated!!

[fishpond]

Graft it onto a compatible rootstock, bearing in mind what you wish the tree to do.

[vicpivo]

I'm a bit of a novice and I wouldn't know how to start grafting them on to another root stock. the tree's themselves, when dug up, had a large existing root system.

I'm hoping they will take again after being re-potting. Am I being a little optimistic? Do I have to graft to ensure the tree survives?

Any advice would be fantastic.

[Kirk]

If they grew from "seeds" I assume you mean plum stones.
If so then they will not be the same as the tree they came from.
The pollination process will have caused the result to be a cross between the tree they fell from and the other tree that was the pollinator.

If they are suckers from the tree then they will be the rootstock and I suspect not worthwhile growing.

You graft to a rootstock to control the eventual size, as you do not say the plum it came from cannot say if that is a vigerous tree or not, so cannot guess to likely result of just growing them on.

I would half guess we limit the tree size most often so would expect an ungrafted one to get to a fair size, 10-15 ft possibly more. All wild ones I have seen tend to be bush more then tree.

If from a stone then you may in effect have a new plum, could be sour as hell or sweet as they come and anything in bewteen. The Vicpivo Plum.

[boundtothesoil]

I agree with Kirk. Plum trees grown from plum stones have a juvenile period during which they will not flower, which is variously quoted in the scientific literature e.g. 2-5 years, 3-7 years.
It's likely to be a fairly long journey into the unknown, with either sucker- or stone- sourced plants. That doesn't mean it's not worthwhile or interesting though.

[vicpivo]

I think the tree is stone sourced, and I think the parent is also unique - the fruit resembles a cross between a Damson, Czar and President Plum.

With whatever cross fertilized this tree, I have no idea what it will turn out like. Great advice Kirk - I will christian this the vicpivo plum.... You heard it here first!

Despite the numerous variances, what is the best way to care for it in it's infancy? I'm guessing to space them about four foot apart and start pruning them annually once they reach about 6 foot tall. Any tips to enable it to mature earlier?

[simon12]

Don't take anything I write as expert advice and I could be wrong, but I think stone grown ungrafted plums generally grow to 6-12m and even those on the most dwarfing root stocks should reach 2.5m. You may keep it much smaller in a pot as it will massively restrict the roots.

[BertieFox]

There's very little point in 'grafting' anything until you know what the fruit is like, and the chances are that from a stone-sown one, you will only get something that is very poor eating. Occasionally of course you get something beautiful and that would be the time to grow it on and graft it to a dwarfing rootstock if you have limited space.

If you don't mind large plum trees, it would be better advice to buy a well known variety that you like and use this as a source for scions that you graft on to a rootstock grown from a stone. That is what is done very often here with apples, where the locals dig up wild apple or cherry tree seedlings to use them as rootstocks for named varieties. The sensible argument is that anything that flourishes in the wild nearby will do well in their gardens... and it seems to work..... though the resulting tree is of course full sized.

[Kristen]

it would be better advice to buy a well known variety that you like and use this as a source for scions that you graft on to a rootstock grown from a stone.

Scion "wood" readily available during the grafting season, so that would be an alternative to grafting from a tree that is already growing nearby.

[orangepippin]

I agree with simon12, if it is grown from seed then it is going to just keep on growing and will probably be in the 14ft-20ft range by year 10.

[Pedigree]

Sorry to continue this thread but I have a question and thought this was an appropriate thread to post on rather than starting a new one. I have a Victoria Plum tree recently planted which was bought from a garden centre. The tree is about 7-8 foot tall. The problem is all the branches and leaves are out of reach as they are at the top of the tree. There are no branches below 7 foot. I was wondering would it be beneficial to chip bud/ graft a bud/scion taken from the top of the tree down lower encourage branches within arms reach?

Your help would be much appreciated

[BertieFox]

Sorry to continue this thread but I have a question and thought this was an appropriate thread to post on rather than starting a new one. I have a Victoria Plum tree recently planted which was bought from a garden centre. The tree is about 7-8 foot tall. The problem is all the branches and leaves are out of reach as they are at the top of the tree. There are no branches below 7 foot. I was wondering would it be beneficial to chip bud/ graft a bud/scion taken from the top of the tree down lower encourage branches within arms reach?

Your help would be much appreciated

Where is the original graft? Some plums here in France are grafted quite high up on a tall stem, so making another graft low down would mean unbalancing the tree. If you create a second graft below you will have to remove the original one eventually. You may find it difficult to get a vigorous branch going if the existing graft is above it, but nothing is lost in trying.

Personally I would prefer to keep the tree as it is, but prevent it from getting any taller. Picking fruit from branches which when heavily laden will droop down should not be a problem, or using some steps. The main disadvantage of what you propose is that you will have to wait several years before you get any fruit, even if the graft takes.

[Nicos]

There is a post a few years ago on here about training fruit tree branches downwards as they grow so that you end up with a shape a bit like a weeping willow.
I've had a quick look but can't find it....maybe you could try and find it, cos it does seem to me to be the answer to your problem!

The tree looked a bit like this in the end...



I accidentally did a similar thing with a young apple tree one year which was heavily laid end with apples and the branches stayed drooping downwards once the fruit was picked.
I now prune the tree into an umbrella shape for ease of picking!

The post I had in mind actually tied the tips of the branches down towards the ground.
Might be the way to go for you?

[Nicos]

Here you are....it's called festooning

http://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gra...html#post65247

[orangepippin]

If you have a young plum tree with already a 7ft clear stem then it might be on a very vigorous rootstock. If so I don't think grafting another scion lower down will achieve much. I also agree with Bertiefox's comments about it probably unbalancing the tree.