espaliered apple tiers query

[seneca196]

Most of the espaliered apple trees I've seen on mm106 rootstock have 3 or 4 tiers and each arm tends to be around the 1.5m long range. What I was curious about was if a tree were to be trained with only 2 tiers, could they have longer arms? Similarly, could a 3 tier espalier have longer arms (over 1.5m long) than a 4 tier. Whilst it makes sense that the arm length should increase with fewer tiers, is this practical? Presumably, longer arms are more difficult to grow straight and are more prone to breaking. Anyone had experience with different proportions of espaliered trees?

[Kirk]

There will be a maximum length simply the general genetics of the tree and 1.0-1.5mtr seems about it. They break otherwise and trees have not evolved expecting homo sapiens to exist to tie them up.

You might get a little longer on a 2 tier as opposed to a 3 tier, simply there is more spare food etc to make 2 a little longer then 3, but it will be very minimal.

Growing straight should not cause a problem as they are tied on to wires for support.

[seneca196]

interesting point about their genetic limitation and only "evolving" through mans intervention, or should that be interference.

Never seen an espalier with 1m long arms. Suppose it would look strange, rather like a flattened spindlebush. Wondering if shortened arms on mm106 rootstock would mean you could plant closer together, as with pyramids?

Is the best way to achieve straight arms to attach them directly to the wire, or should they be attached to bamboo canes and those supported by wires. I've seen this done with fans in order to form equally spaced branches and other ornamental affects.

[Kristen]

I think the issue is the distance from the trunk to the end of the branch, rather than the number of tiers. But I also don't think its a hard and fast rule, so a bit more won't hurt ... but a lot more is likely to be a problem.

I considered the width of an espalier tree provided me with an opportunity to plant more varieties, rather than being a problem! but if the length of my proposed espalier was 4.5 units then I might consider planting 4 and giving each a bit more room, although planting 5 trees at a tighter spacing is also an option. of course the longer the length then the easier it is to squeeze one more / less in.

[seneca196]

call it boxing day "slow brain" but do you mean 4 espaliers in 4.5m? On MM106, surely not - that would give tiny arms. On the other hand (waking up) 4.5m length for an espalier on MM106 is good going, as each arm would be over 2m. Whilst there is no hard and fast rule, as you can limit the arms to whatever width you chose, surely the rootstock would be a big factor: short arms for closer planting means less room for roots and the limited space would impact on the growth rate of the tree ie. to get wider espaliers they need to be more spaced out to allow the extra growth. If cramped then less lower growth rate smaller espalier. Sorry to sound confusing, but a bit foggy today (me and weather outside.)