Old vs Modern Strawberries and Raspberries

[Hereford fruit grower]

I'm not talking about Royal Sovereign strawberry or Lloyd George raspberry, which are very old indeed and well before my time.

But does anyone else find that just a few of the very best older varieties outperform the modern and much-hyped ones?

I have an old raspberry, probably from the 1970s or earlier. It's far outperforming Autumn Bliss, although it takes a break between the summer and autumn crops which I'll need to fil with another one. It's also doing OK in this drought without added water so far, although it would prefer to be in a less sunny location.

I have an old strawberry, possibly Talisman. For a gardener, it's level with or ahead of all the modern varieties I've tried. Especially for those who use it as rampant edible ground cover, because it makes hundreds of runners.

Symphony may have as good a flavour, and has firmer fruit. But it seems to crop poorly on plants over about two years old. It makes very few runners either, so no use for ground cover.

It doesn't seem to like the drought either. Talisman, or whatever it is, is doing fine and in this weather the fruit has almost no slug damage.

Does anyone know how I might identify them both? To be this good, they're surely past commercial varieties. If I could find a picture of Talisman, that might confirm it.

[Nicos]

Can you post a picture of the Talisman and raspberry plant and fruit...?

[nickdub]

Can't comment personally on the ones you mention, but I have been wondering if it might be worth compiling a list of fruit varieties which have excellent flavour on here which others could refer to.

[Nicos]

^^^^ brill idea!

[Losos]

I have been wondering if it might be worth compiling a list of fruit varieties which have excellent flavour on here which others could refer to.

nickdub - What a great idea, I also feel like the OP that these newer varieties, (while they may have some specific good points) are generally not as tasty as the older ones.

For example, I have within the last hour harvested the black currants from one bush 'Ebony' yes very big berries BUT taste is definately not like the older varities and the 'strigs' are short which makes cutting a whole strig in one go difficult.

Likewise my 'Ruby Beauty' bush rasberry does not taste like the older varities that I remember from my youth (OK we're talking a long time ago here )

I'm sorry I can't identify the strawberry 'Talisman' we've had some of the newer ones and tend to agree with the OP.

[nickdub]

Glad a few people are interested in the idea of listing varieties recommended for flavour. I can kick the ball off with 3 sorts - if enough other people chip in perhaps one of the mods will be able to do something with it.
1) Blackcurrant "Wellington XXX"
2) Gooseberry "Early Sulphur"
3) Tayberry original thorned sort

[Brack]

I wish I could tell you which of my strawberries taste best, but the winter after I planted them a storm removed all my little lolly sticks. They do taste much better than shop bought or indeed those my neighbour kindly gave us. No fertiliser, no water, just neglect. I wonder if that contributes to the flavour rather than being pumped up with water and fertiliser?

[4Shoes]

I've 5 varieties. I everbearing and 4 others.

I've found the flavour in the thicker skinned ones to be lacking. These had been developed for the supermarket / transporting to reduce damage. Cambridge Favourite is thin skinned and in a warm day is a delight with cream straight off the patch.

[Bex2012]

For best tasting raspberries can I add Joan J? The berries are huge and taste like the smell of roses... Mine are already fruiting and taste better than the summer ones down the other end of the bed.

[It never rains..it pours]

Can't comment personally on the ones you mention, but I have been wondering if it might be worth compiling a list of fruit varieties which have excellent flavour on here which others could refer to.

Great idea

[Hereford fruit grower]

Sorry, I can't post any photos right now as my camera's developed problems; the card may be corrupted. If the thread continues, I will try in due course.

Cambridge Favourite used to be *the* UK commercial variety. I've never seen Talisman but as I said I suspect my mystery variety might be it.

C. Favourite was never considered very tasty, although it was reasonable. It was very heavy-cropping though, had extremely large fruit and stayed firm until fairly ripe, reducing losses in transport.

Some strawberries grown only in gardens were claimed to taste better but didn't crop as well. I once picked strawberries when a student and Gorella was both very nice and 'commercial'. I can't remember any other 'commercial' varieties tasting much good. In particular, Redgauntlet was tasteless.

Symphony is equal in flavour to my mystery one. In my garden it just seems to suffer from the faults I mentioned, e.g. not enough runners, doesn't like drought, old plants stop cropping, etc.

I sometimes wonder if there's some mixing the genes up for the sake of it to earn plant breeders' royalties. The fact that Cambridge Favourite is still grown >50 years after it was bred - and has an RHS AGM - shows that 'stars' don't come along very often. How many 'wonderful' strawberries have come and gone in that time?