Espalier fruit trellis, how to support the posts without concreting them in

[TrixC]

I want to build a trellis at my allotment to espalier some fruit trees along one side of my plot. All the guides I can find seem to be based on building a permanent structure with posts secured in concrete, which wouldn't be allowed on my site. Are there other ways to build a structure which is adequately strong without the use of concrete to secure the posts?

[Guest]

If the ground is quite heavy just make sure the posts go deep in to the ground. If the soil is loose you will need to support the posts with struts of some sort to strengthen/ make them more stable.

[roitelet]

If you can get hold of stone ram that in round the posts before covering with soil. Stone drains better than concrete and the posts don't rot as fast. As I have more stone in the ground than I want I have used this method for some years and the posts are still in place and strong. The posts go about 18ins into the ground.

[TrixC]

If you can get hold of stone ram that in round the posts before covering with soil. Stone drains better than concrete and the posts don't rot as fast. As I have more stone in the ground than I want I have used this method for some years and the posts are still in place and strong. The posts go about 18ins into the ground.

What size of stone are we talking? Pea gravel size or larger stones?

[Jay-ell]

I have some half bricks ramed around the posts of my front fence. You need to get the posts in about 2' to support the trellis.

For my currant/kiwi trellis I used metal fence post holders.

[roitelet]

What size of stone are we talking? Pea gravel size or larger stones?

Assorted sizes, some larger ones then smaller ones to fill the spaces and a sledge hammer to use as a ram or a hefty chunk of wood will do.

[Alison]

Would you be allowed to use the spiked version of something like meta posts (not sure if the spelling is right)? I concreted mind in, we're not supposed to concrete things but it's along the fence line and everybody has done it for their fence posts, didn't for my polytunnel frame though which is more central.

[Starling]

Ok, I can weigh in here as I've done this hundreds of times:

First, what kind of trees are we talking for the espalier? are they evergreens, or are they going to defoliate, like cherries?

Secondly, if you're not going to crete in your support posts, you're going to need to set them considerably deeper than 2 feet--definitely. You must also consider the type of wood you're using if you're using wood--it must be copper treated pine (lasts longer than copper treated hardwood, believe it or not, because those nasty chems don't penetrated far into hardwood).

Or, you could do it the smart way, which is to create a thing called a sand sleeve for your post which will give you the strength of concrete ( well, not really--but not far off) and when you're ready to move it/pull up stumps, you simply vacuum out the sand and voila. Now, a sand sleeve is meant to have concrete around it--but this isn't necessary. However, I would inquire as to if the issue is actually using concrete in the ground as opposed to setting posts permanently in the ground--I'm guessing it's the latter, because concrete is technically just a type of soil. If this is the case, you can go ahead and concrete around your sand sleeve, and if anyone kicks up a fuss, you can just pop ot the post on demand with nothing more than a vacuum cleaner.

I'm a law student and am happy to take a look at your tenancy agreement/building code, I might find something. But to do that I'd need to read it.


This video shows how easy it is to make a sand sleeve.
What you need to see in the video starts at 2:30 seconds in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_cjZ_B-wH0

[Nicos]

Interesting link!

[Starling]

Interesting link!

Works like a charm. Even fencers will use sand sleeves.