Thin and tall seedlings, and fleece question

[jdlondon]

My greens, mustard and orientals, shot up all spindly and promptly fell over. The unlucky ones snapped.

I've read up on it and majority opinion seems to be lack of light, except there really wasn't - it's been sunny here and they've been on the sill or on the balcony if the wind is not bad.

So I'm wondering if it's too warm, ie too good a condition so they're racing up? I cover them loosely with clingfilm too at night. Should I leave them outside - and even, should I have started them outside?

Any ideas?

Also, when you say cover with a fleece if cold, do you cover it with plastic/polytunnel first, or plastic over the fleece or no plastic at all? Would mulching with bark/newspaper be sufficient?

[northepaul]

Hi there,
are the salad leaves outside or inside mostly?

[perkin]

I would suggest they should be outside - they shouldn't need to be coddled this time of year. Also, some don't do too well in full sun, so if you have a slightly shady side to your balcony then they'll probably do best there.
As for your seedlings shooting up and then falling over, this sounds like it could be damping off - a fungal disease exacerbated by moist conditions. Might you be overwatering a bit?

[jdlondon]

They're mostly inside, only take them out when it's not too hot, not too windy, not too wet - basically, just was easier to keep them in!

But I'll take them out now, leave them in a shaded part the next few days, see if it helps.

[Two_Sheds]

You shouldn't be putting clingfilm on seedlings (it encourages moulds etc) - only use it when trying to germinate seeds

[jdlondon]

So many traps and pitfalls awaiting newbies! - so what's teh difference between clingfilm and plastic polytunnels and glass/plastic cloches? Or is none of these advisable for seedlings, only to be used when more grown?

[rustylady]

At this time of year you shouldn't need any cover to germinate or grow seeds. Clingfilm sits too close to seeds/seedlings and encourages a really damp atmosphere.

[Two_Sheds]

what's teh difference between clingfilm and plastic polytunnels and glass/plastic cloches? Or is none of these advisable for seedlings ...?

Clingfilm gives you a nice moist little microclimate, to germinate your seeds. Then it comes off before it rots your seedlings

Cloches are used to extend the growing season, when the weather is colder

Sometimes they're used in warmer weather to exclude pests, but they do fog up - you want a pest cover that is breathable, like fleece or net, so that air can flow and prevent moulds

Think about how mouldy your bathroom gets if it's kept shut up and steamy

[jdlondon]

I should have thought of damp and mould, just didn't occur to me what with being obsessed with keeping them warm. The ones I left outside seem perkier, so far so good.

Thanks, all!

[snohare]

A tip worth remembering for the future is to always water from below, and water with chamomile "tea" - a chamomile teabag dipped in water until it turns golden - to prevent damping off.
Fleece is always used on its own, because its main advantage over cloches and the like is its extra permeability to moisture, both in and out.
Depending on which chemical pathway they use of the 3 available by which to manufacture energy from photosynthesis, some plants will struggle inside a house because they need more UV (or different wavelengths) than they will get once the sunlight has been "filtered" by glass. This is why greenhouses use horticultural glass.
There is an art to the simplest thing...

[jdlondon]

When you say water from below, do you mean putting water in the saucers instead of the foot of the plants?

I saw some garden fleece in Lidl, £1.something, so I'll get one. I honestly thought I could use some fleece throws that had seen better days ...

Never knew about the horticultural glass. Thought it was just glass. It's a whole new world!

[snohare]

Yes, water into a dish or tray and then let the plant soak up what it needs. Don't rewater (generally) until the water has all disappeared. Many plants like a constantly changing pH gradient, and this is determined by moisture levels, so dropping moisture content in the growing medium can be a good thing ! (But of course some plants need lots of watering, generally the bigger the leaves/amount of fruit, the more they need.)
Well, once winter is hard upon us and the shrubs become dormant, some plants might like a normal fleece blanket for insulation ! But personally I use horticultural fleece. (Actually, these days I am swapping over to multiple layers of Enviromesh. Wonderful stuff.)
You can grow many if not most plants using normal glass - I only use old windows - because the extra heat trapped speeds up their metabolism and makes up for any energy deficit in other ways; but some, particularly those from hotter climes/higher altitudes, are more demanding. Hmm, I wonder if sweet potatoes are one of them ?
Have you tried vertical gardening, using the wall ?

[jdlondon]

Vertical gardening - I was going to hang up chicken wire and then hang containers from it, but then I saw those slanted shelves which apparently keep moisture and basically is better all round. Can't afford whatever they were originally made of, but I'm thinking diy it. Also already got the pallet thing ready with my own twist so I can grow the deep rooting daikon on top with greens on the side.

Why camomile tea?