Weed madness!

[ColourMeSurprised]

Hey guys, newbie here.

So I've just recently gotten into growing my own veg. We moved into the new house in Mid-May, and it's the first time I've had my own garden, as an adult. Much excitement!

I managed to dig out a few small beds and tried out a bunch of stuff this summer; tomatoes, 3 different kinds of lettuce, courgettes, butternut squash (failed because the cats dug away at its roots :/), dwarf french beans, mangetout, basil, chives, mint, parsley, strawberries and jalapeno peppers. Now that the plants in the beds are all spent, I've pulled them out and majorly expanded the small beds so that they meet make a larger one. I'm sure it's still pretty small by most people's standards (only just over 1m x 2m), but it seems very indulgent to me! I'm also looking at getting a 1.25m squared raised bed kit, to give square foot gardening a go, in the spring.

ANYWAY, rambleramble.

Basically because I've been so excited by all of this, I've left the end of the garden to become very overrun with weeds and now that I've decided to actually tackle them, I'm not really sure of the best way.

When we first moved in, I had a go at digging/pulling them out by hand, but it took a hideous amount of time to clear even a tiny area. There has to be a better way, right? I was thinking of going in there with a hedge trimmer, chopping everything as low to the ground as possible and covering it with... something? Something cheap, preferably. XD I have cardboard to hand, and could get more from work, if it would be of use. Would this be likely to work? I'd really like to be able to use that area next year, but could just use some advice as to how best to tackle it, I guess?

[Vince G]

Welcom to the Vine. You've done pretty well for your first summer with a garden, by the sounds of it.

Pulling weeds out really is the best way. If you chop them down you risk chucking their seeds everywhere. Won't take you long with a garden fork, assuming your soil's not rock hard. Then chuck some compost or muck in it, then cover with your cardboard until early spring, or plant some over-wintering onions, peas or broad beans in it. At least that's what I'd do!

PS: if you put your location in your header, it helps people advise you in line with your local conditions

[arpoet]

Welcome C-M-S. Weeds are a continual war and bare soil is a magnet to weeds. I cover bare soil with carpet or cardboard when not in production.

[Kristen]

Most weeds will die down in Winter, and then come again in Spring - either from seed [the Annual weeds] or from roots [the perennial, pernicious, weeds]. There's an old adage "One year's seed = Seven year's weed", so a #1 objective should be to prevent them setting seed. Even if you just chop the tops off, before they flower, or before the flowers set seed, that's a start.

If you can get the soil into workable state - the top dug over / loosened up - than one option is to hoe. You need to do this regularly, during the growing season, perhaps once a week but done regularly like that it will be easy - the top inch or two of soil will remain loose, and the weeds will be tiny. Annual weeds will be killed by being disrupted in this way, pernicious weeds will be weakened by repeatedly having their heads cut off. Another adage: "Never let them see a Sunday"

You can cover the soil - cardboard is good, particularly if you can get large pieces, the sort of boxes that kitchen white goods, or bicycles, come in. That raises the question what are you going to cover it with? as the cardboard on its own will look unsightly (probably fine for a veg patch, not so good for the ornamental garden)

If you cover with compost or manure etc. then weeds will grow in that. Its only a thin layer, over the cardboard, so easy to weed - but not entirely zero maintenance.

The key really is to a) get on top of it and b) stay on top of it, then it is only little & often, rather than a monumental task and a chore.

[Scarlet]

I've found if I cover the soil with a large piece of card it's a magnet for rats & mice. Lovely and cosy for nesting and private runs

[Guest]

I used to be very anti weedkiller, however nowadays I am more - if it does what you want then go for it! (just don't make a habit of it) Every solution has good and bad points just find what works for you

[Two_Sheds]

could just use some advice as to how best to tackle it, I guess?

Strim or shear down the weeds to ground level, then cover with your cardboard and/or wet newspapers, weighted down with rocks/soil/more weeds/manure/whatever

By spring you'll have lovely crumbly, wormy, weed-free soil, and any remaining card can go on the compost heap

[ColourMeSurprised]

Wow, thanks for all the responses, guys. Okay, so I definitely won't chop them down once they've flowered. Silly idea.

What I'm considering doing is using weedkiller to spray them down first. My boyfriend's parents are florists and his dad used to be a teacher of gardening/agriculture/etc, and advised that. Plus he has a load of the weedkiller and the means to spray it, and has offered me it.

So I was planning on spraying first, and then once the majority have died back a bit, digging them out with a spade/fork. Since I'm not planning on growing food there for at least the next year (or really ever, so far as I know), I'm not too concerned about the chemicals in the spray getting into the soil. It's a good distance from my veggie bed, too. Then once I got the weeds out I'd break up the soil and hoe it once a week to keep any surviving perennials down.

Sound like a reasonable plan?

[veggiechicken]

Hello CMS and welcome to the Grapevine.
I've seen your other thread about plot-sharing so why don't you use this ground for growing edibles? Its much easier to keep on top of things in your garden when you can pop out there for 10 minutes or so than it is on an allotment that may be some distance away.
I would only use weedkiller as an absolute last resort. What weeds do you have?

[Hazel at the Hill]

What I'm considering doing is using weedkiller to spray them down first. My boyfriend's parents are florists and his dad used to be a teacher of gardening/agriculture/etc, and advised that. Plus he has a load of the weedkiller and the means to spray it, and has offered me it.

So I was planning on spraying first, and then once the majority have died back a bit, digging them out with a spade/fork. Since I'm not planning on growing food there for at least the next year (or really ever, so far as I know), I'm not too concerned about the chemicals in the spray getting into the soil. It's a good distance from my veggie bed, too. Then once I got the weeds out I'd break up the soil and hoe it once a week to keep any surviving perennials down.

Sound like a reasonable plan?

Hmm.

Strim or shear down the weeds to ground level, then cover with your cardboard and/or wet newspapers, weighted down with rocks/soil/more weeds/manure/whatever

By spring you'll have lovely crumbly, wormy, weed-free soil, and any remaining card can go on the compost heap

For me, this is a better plan.

Partly because it is far less effort, but also not spraying (although tempting as the spray is free!) it is far less 'poisonous' to the ground/environment, which generally 'sits better' with me, and - I'm guessing - most gardeners, who would like to work with, and not against, nature.

[Kristen]

I take a different view on weedkiller, but its personal choice of course.

I think if a one time application gets a plot under control, and is then used for something productive, that's a Good Thing. I see a lot of prospective vegetable growers giving up in the first season because getting the plot under control is a challenge-too-far. I am also very firmly in the camp that there are many Rant web sites making out that Monsanto and Roundup are bad, and poisonous etc. but I don't see proper, peer-reviewed, scientific evidence of that. I am also minded that the Tobacco companies "hid" scientific evidence that pointed to smoking being a killer ... so it is possible that Monsanto are doing the same, but it seems to me that SO much Roundup is used in agriculture that if there were seriously adverse effects they would be all too apparent by now.

But ... I grow my own veg to be certain in the knowledge that it has nothing added - no pesticides, no herbicides, at all. Although I now worry about chemicals from timber framing raised beds, and plasticisers some mulching fabric / fleece / bird/insect netting etc. getting into my food ...

I sprayed my plot with Roundup, just the once, to give me a flying start and I personally have absolutely no regrets about that and, if starting again tomorrow, would definitely do it again.

[Two_Sheds]

I'm not planning on growing food there ... I'd break up the soil and hoe it once a week

So, are you wanting just bare brown soil?

Me, I don't like hoeing, and I'd prefer to grow something useful, if not for me then for the bees & butterflies. Ground cover planting & mulches will do a better job all round than the hoe.

I sprayed my plot with Roundup, just the once, to give me a flying start

... and I've used it on weeds that I can't reach to dig/pull out by hand (ones that are in the neighbouring patch and just left to flower, seed and invade my garden).

[ColourMeSurprised]

I'm reluctant to use the area for growing edibles because it's overshadowed by a HUGE hedge, as well as some trees. So although my garden is very warm and sunny (south-west facing), that patch get very little direct sun as the hedge blocks it all. Also, I'm talking about quite a large area here. While it might be good for growing some things, I really struggle with tree roots in my garden, and I'm concerned that the hedge there would have some pretty massive roots to thwart any attempts to grow fruit & veggies. XD

I don't plan to have it as a bare patch of land, no. I was planning to sow grass seed there once it's clear, and try to extend the lawn up to the hedge. I meant hoe once a week until the weeds stopped (or at least slowed in) coming back. I guess I could plant a perennial bees & butterflies flower mix or something, but would that compete with the weeds well enough? Since the area is deep enough that I wouldn't be able to reach to the back.

Yeah, I'm not talking about spraying frequently. I'm thinking like Kristen said; just once to get things workable, and then keeping on top of things by hand from then on.

[Vince G]

Weedkiller is OK, I do use nasty stuff on things like horsetail, but I try to avoid it and use the garden fork instead. Weedkiller usually has the effect of dessicating weeds and thus they again chuck seed everywhere.

TS's suggestion is good, grow some stuff for the bees and butterflies - Mrs Vince and I have been planting a perennials bed over the last year or so against a west facing fence (so sunshine from mid afternoon) and it does not take long for certain plants to totally smother out the weeds. I would recommend things like Achillea, Coreopsis, Gaillardia, Heliopsis, even certain types of Aster form dense bushes and ground cover.

Now is the time to get some very cheap perennial collections, in fact Dobies of Devon sent me an email today quoting 80% off for a lucky dip - everyone wants to sell what they can at the end of the season and will take whatever they can get for them. J Parker are brilliant, and contrary to some Grapes, I've never had many problems with T&M.

Avoid Van Meuwen though, ordered a preennial collection from them 6 plants each of 9 varieties, and they substituted 8 of the 9 varieties !!! So I only got 6 of the 72 plants I wanted !!! Got my money back though

[ColourMeSurprised]

Haha, I had that email too, Vince. That was the collection I was thinking of, actually. But surely if I was to get it now, then they'd really need planting out before I could have the weed-ridden area ready, no? Plus I'm not sure if that patch would be sunny enough for that collection. There was a shade-loving lucky dip in that email though, so that'd be a possibility. Though again, I'm concerned that I'd have them hanging around in pots for too long.