Keeping Chooks on the same ground????

[Hilary B]

Over-simplified (but gives the general idea) lime lecture.
The lime generally available would probably be dried slaked lime, which is relatively mildly caustic, and had preservative properties, it can slow down the decomposition of (for instance) a dead animal, and much reduce the smell given off in the process.
Less widely available, and much more dangerous, is quicklime, which is highly hygroscopic. This means that it absorbs water with enthusiasm, including the water in your person if you let the powder get on your skin. Breathing it in is even more dangerous!
Commercially quicklime is added to water (NEVER the other way around) to make lime putty, which is the basis of traditional mortar, for building, pointing and rendering on old buildings. Lime putty is slaked lime in a wet form; this can be dried without de-slaking it, which is the basis for the powder sold for so many purposes.
If you remember 'lime water' from the school biology lessons, that is the excess liquid left after slaking the quicklime.

[Snadger]

poultry manure is generally acidic...............

Not according to the RHS!

[Hilary B]

Bird poo in general contains a fair amount of Uric Acid, but I think it quite quickly starts decomposing to Ammonia.

[Bramble-Poultry]

well the RHS has a bit of a cop out there. they seem to suggest that it has a ph between 6 and 8. well make your minds up, is it acid or alkaline!!

off to investigate the answer!!!

[Snadger]

well the RHS has a bit of a cop out there. they seem to suggest that it has a ph between 6 and 8. well make your minds up, is it acid or alkaline!!

off to investigate the answer!!!

6.5 is slightly acidic/nearly neutral whereas 8 is very alkaline, so a mean average would be 7.25 or tending towards alkaline as stated.

If using layers pellets these have lime added to help create the eggshell.

Like most animals, you usually get out a certain proportion, as waste, of what you put in?

[Glutton4...]

Seeeeeee!!!!! Now you know why I was confuzzed!


I still am!

[Bramble-Poultry]

ok - according to DEFRA (groan i can hear it from here) neat poultry litter (manure and shavings etc) is acid when dry. once wet, the urea is converted quickly into ammonia which is highly alkaline.

It is their suggestion (based on the document i was reading was for the spreading of poultry litter on fields as a means of disposal) that you either spread at the rate of 5 tonnes per hectare, for no more than two years running and check pH and adjust accordingly in the third year, or, compost the litter in an enclosed composter so that the temperature reaches a minimum of 60 degrees celcius (as this will destroy most pathogens), this then can be spread across the ground or used as a natural additive to cultivated soils where it will only be at a pH of around 7 - 7.5.

Does that make sense to you scientist type people?

[Hilary B]

pH 8 is moderately alkaline. VERY alkaline is 12-14!

[francesbean]

I was wondering about this too, and not having any spare space to put the chooks whilst liming, I found a Bokashi product on the Omlet website - that seems to come highly recommended. Apparantly you add it to their feed and it neutralises the poo. It can also be used to deodorise the coop. I'm going to buy some and try it. Even though I don't have a problem with smelly coop or the area (unlike a neighbour who keeps some chickens and his garden stinks!) they live in, I too was worried about the state of the ground as it can get rather compacted in the summer, and I usually end up giving it a going over with my garden fork.

francesbean

[Dazy]

I guess that my set up is quite small compared to most on here but I have kept 3 chickens in a small urban garden for nearly two years and so far managed to keep it odour free. I have an eglu classic with a 2m x 4m covered WIR, run is placed on a slabbed edge with mud in the middle covered with woodchip. 2 or three times a year I rake and sieve out old woodchip and then lime the soil (garden lime from wilkos) then chuck in new woodchip, general maintainence includes fortnightly cleans i.e. scrubbing perches etc, spraying with poultry shield and a good sprinkle of bio dri on the woodchips. I add bokashi bran to their feed once a week and there is always a clove of garlic in their drinking water. As I said mine is only a small set up but the important thing is to keep my chooks healthy and my neighbours happy

[Hilary B]

6.5 is slightly acidic/nearly neutral whereas 8 is very alkaline, so a mean average would be 7.25 or tending towards alkaline as stated.

If using layers pellets these have lime added to help create the eggshell.

Like most animals, you usually get out a certain proportion, as waste, of what you put in?

The lime included in feed for shell formation is limestone, which is pretty much pH neutral. The processing to make slaked lime is what turns it alkaline.

[Snadger]

pH 8 is moderately alkaline. VERY alkaline is 12-14!

pH - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

My head hurts.................

PS I've never tested any soil that is above Ph 8 locally,but would imagine the White Cliffs of Dover would give a high reading!

[Glutton4...]

pH - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

My head hurts.................

Berlimey! Mine too!

Ever wished you'd never asked a question...?

[Hilary B]

pH - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

My head hurts.................

PS I've never tested any soil that is above Ph 8 locally,but would imagine the White Cliffs of Dover would give a high reading!

Simplified, pH can be anything up to 14, 7 is neutral, anything above that is alkaline (or 'basic') anything below is acid. Battery acid is about pH 1, sodium hydroxide (caustic soda) is about 14.
When talking about soil, 8 may be towards the high end of actual readings, because soil will nearly always be close to 'neutral' in the strict sense. Slaked lime will give a much higher figure than any lime-based soil (perhaps as high as 11 or 12).
On a more practical note, even if chook poo reads as alkaline, it may have acidic substances in it that would be usefully neutralised by lime.

[Snadger]

...............On a more practical note, even if chook poo reads as alkaline, it may have acidic substances in it that would be usefully neutralised by lime.

I reckon that because chooks wee and poo in one dollop, the poo will be acid but the wee (white bit) will be alkaline and cancel out the acidity of the poo to the extent that the sum total will end up slightly alkaline?

Methinks also that worms are more prevalent in alkaline soil, so by raising the alkalinity more worms will shift the surface detritus and incorporate it into the lower levels faster?

Just a thought though! (Clever stuff this poo lark!)