Mites or Lice - who knows, but want to be rid of them

[Gorsty]

Hi folks

For several weeks now I have been struggling to eradicate my chicken house from tiny (pin head size) insects - I'm not sure what they are - may lice or the dreaded red mite but some of my girls won't to bed at night and they have decidedly pale faces so assume they are being eaten/bled to death.

Steam cleaned the house, last weekend and put in fresh bedding and have been spraying the inside walls & door with Poultry Shield every morning when they go out to roam. Have also used 1 squirt of Frontline spray (for cats & dogs) on each of the girls. Should I spray them again?

Just been to collect the eggs and they are absolutely crawling with these critters - yuk.

I was wondering if one of those smoke bomb type things that you use in greenhouses to rid of insect pests would help?

I've read that creosote substitute is the thing to use but as this is only hen house we have then that is really not something that we can try.

Obviously need to do something more than we are doing so would appreciate any expert advice please.

Many thanks

[Glutton4...]

Go and get a bag or bucket of Diatom (Diatomaceous Earth) it's about the only thing that will work. Cover every nook and cranny, crack and crevice with it. Mix it with their bedding and in their dust bath holes. Puff some under each wing, and cover the ends of each perch with it.

Last time I had them, I also covered myself in it, as I have eczema on my scalp, and it felt like I was alive with the ruddy things. Then I jumped in the bath!

[Nicos]

Have a look at these two stickied threads....

http://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gra...tml#post505116

http://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gra...tml#post519688

they may be of help too

[Floyd]

If you have a large enough secure run, then leave the hens in there without a coop until you eradicate the problem. The weather is warm enough for them to roost outside in a covered run overnight, they'll come to more harm in an infested coop. if you have the means of building or buying a new coop, then do so and burn the old one. If not then jetwash the coop and spray with a mix of vinegar and washing up liquid (the mites will come pouring out), then use creocote liberally and leave 2 or 3 days before reintroducing your flock.
Red mites can live for 8-10 months without a feed, so you really need to be doing this every year to keep the buggers at bay.

[Glutton4...]

Now you see, I don't agree with all that hassle, Floyd. A bucket of Diatom, even at £40+ is a much cheaper and much faster solution to the problem.

[kathyd]

Or a cardboard box in a garage or shed works as a temporary home for 2 or 3 days while you creocote.. and then diatom! Red mites WILL kill your birds, so don't hang around...

[Gorsty]

I really don't know whether I am dealing with the dreaded red mite or whether it is just lice! I locked them in their run last night but stopped them from going inside the actual house.

I have seen red things in the bedding in the past which I assumed WERE the dreaded red mites so re-acted immediately and sprayed/cleaned for England but what I've seen more recently both on the girls and in the house are tiny pin head size things so my thinking it is lice.

Anyhow, have put louse dust in their dust bath areas - have Frontline sprayed the girls yesterday, smoke bombed their house this morning with a Permethrin smoke thing. The plan this afternoon is to ventilate their house, probably spray it with Poultry Shield and maybe put down louse powder on the floor before I put the bedding back and if that fails, expect it's creocote here we come.

Do you think it is red mite - have looked at photos on the internet and they look bigger than these pin head size things that are on the girls.?????

Anyhow, thanks for your thoughts - the battle continues.....

xxxx

[Gorsty]

Hi ya

Have just been to ventilate the girls' house in order to spring clean - guess what?! they are still alive and that's after using the Permethran smokebomb. The bedding is still alive with them OMG!

I just feel like setting fire to the house.

We've nail varnished some on to a microscope slide so may be able to identify them shortly.

In the meantime I will go and poultry shield the house and burn the bedding - this is turning into a nightmare.

[Nicos]

* scrat scrat!

good luck with them Gorsty...I don't envy you at all

[Scarlet]

Sounds like red mite to me. Lice live on the bird not in the house. I'd use diatom on the birds and the house as G4 has suggested and Creocote as well if you can give the birds another home for a night or two.

[BUFFS]

Go and get a bag or bucket of Diatom (Diatomaceous Earth) it's about the only thing that will work. Cover every nook and cranny, crack and crevice with it. Mix it with their bedding and in their dust bath holes. Puff some under each wing, and cover the ends of each perch with it.

Last time I had them, I also covered myself in it, as I have eczema on my scalp, and it felt like I was alive with the ruddy things. Then I jumped in the bath!

I used the diatom(the only thing that really works) and washed each bird with puppy shampoo, up to their necks in the warm water, really rubbing it in and I used 4 rinsing buckets to make sure it was all cleared, I got these tips on here and they worked all the time I had the chooks, and they never kicked up a fuss when I washed them and after looking like drowned rats for half an hour they then looked like show birds til they reached the dust bath...

[Gorsty]

Hello again folks - the microscope revealed that they are the dreaded red mite in various stages of development I think.

I have resprayed the house with Poultry Shield and dired it out and have now covered the house floor in louse power but don't intend to let the girls inside for the next few days. Have ordered up some Diatom and have even been looking at a new house for them as a temporary residence - I get the feeling that this is going to be a very long battle.

Question - if red mites live in the house and not the girls though, what are the little specky things that I can on their feathers - will the Frontline or louse powder deal with those??

xxxxxxx

[Nicos]

As far as I am aware the red lice are only present on the chooks during the night.
Can you take a swab mid afternoon...you may get a better insite into what is there then???

Frontline ...sadly we ( ie this forum) can't allow comments on that as it's not approved for chooks. ( pm's aside )
I suggest you gooogle elsewhere and make your own mind up on that.

good luck... I dread the day when this happens to us...and as sure as eggs are eggs , it will

[kathyd]

I suppose it's possible you have both lice AND red mites! Argh! But that would explain why you're finding things on the birds as well as in the house. And I don't care what anyone says, I find red mites crawling around the outhouse where our coop is located during the day, so they're not purely nocturnal, although I don't know if they only feed at night or not. For me it's a case of just trying to keep the coop itself clear, as realistically I'll never get rid of them from the whole building. My friend who had a massive infestation of red mites recently didn't recognise them for what they were, and found herself changing her clothes twice a day and her bedding daily because so many had transferred themselves to her...she'd find them crawling en masse on her bedroom windowsill and everything, *shudder *... so I guess if you have a bad dose of them, they could be found on your birds at any time, but possibly just feeding at night? Maybe they sit on top of the feathers during the day and burrow down at night for a nosh? I don't know, but I wouldn't rule them out and assume they're lice just because you see them during the day, sorry .

I do dust periodically with a pyrethrum-based powder as well as using diatom, because I find all sorts of things crawling through the diatom I've sprinkled on the floor of the outhouse, so I'm never 100% sure whether it kills every creepy crawly or not - no idea whether the poor little spiders and beetles will die after their diatom experience, or whether they're immune in some way, and I don't want to take any chances. But I only use diatom in the house itself, plus add it to the dust baths occasionally so the girls can help take care of themselves too.

Initially, I used 2 different well known 'red mite killer' products (can't remember which, sorry), on the house when we had our outbreak, but they only worked for a very few days and the red mites were back within a week - hence my fixation on creocote which 'appears' to have kept us free for over a year so far... touch wood.

As for appearance - all the lice I've found have been bigger than a pin-head, and the mites are pinhead sized & definitely smaller than a flea. Plus I've never seen lice on top of the feathers, only at the base next to the skin, but maybe I've just not noticed them or been lucky so far - but I'd be instantly suspicious of anything visible without parting the feathers, just to be on the safe side.

I think it must be a very bad year for red mites this year if it's any consolation - everyone I know or hear about seems to be having a problem with them, so don't take it personally!

[Glutton4...]

Like you, Kathy, I used a well-known spray originally. Have to say I swore by it, as I only had an infestation when my Dad was 'looking after' my Chooks, during my convalescence. However, once you have them, it seems to become ineffective, hence my switching to Diatom.

My old neighbour's Chooks were always riddled with lice, and usually mites too. He said it was 'normal' and. I knew no better at the time. Since then, and having my own, I can't believe how ignorant (or lazy, perhaps?) he was with regard to their well being. . No wonder he was always having to replace sick birds.

Anyway, I hope the OP is on top of it now, it is fast-acting, so you should be ok, but remember to keep dosing the vulnerable areas regularly. Good luck!