Do you garden organically?

[weekendwellies]

I am surprised by some of the contributors stating that they use slug pellets. These should certainly be banned as they have caused untold deaths of birds, frogs, toads, hedgehogs etc as well as domestic pets.

I refuse to use them for just that reason Tam. My lettuces have suffered for it though. Any acceptable means of slug control suggestions anyone? I tried beer in a margarine tub last year and got loads in the back garden, but I cant get to the lottie every day to empty the tub out.

[teakdesk]

I am surprised by some of the contributors stating that they use slug pellets. These should certainly be banned as they have caused untold deaths of birds, frogs, toads, hedgehogs etc as well as domestic pets.

What evidence do you have for this statement?

This year I had a frog living, no - thriving, in my warm frame that I only saw when I added more slug pellets. It hopped off when I dismantled my warm frame.

I think I've killed more frogs with my lawn mower than with slug pellets...

... or do you want to ban lawn mowers as well?


Please quote evidence if you make wild statements like this.

[zazen999]

I am surprised by some of the contributors stating that they use slug pellets. These should certainly be banned as they have caused untold deaths of birds, frogs, toads, hedgehogs etc as well as domestic pets.

I use the organic ones now; the chap at Garden Organic tested them and if he uses them and recommends them above any other method of slug control, then I am happy to use them too.

I personally don't like the other ones as the slugs seem to explode....and leave a horrid mess......and that's before any other animal comes over and eats the slugs or the pellets....i don't know the facts surrounding their use but I just don't like them.

[Tam]

From a garden wildlife point of view, therefore, slug pellets of either type should be avoided where possible. Birds and hedgehogs may under certain circumstances be killed by eating pellets, although the introduction of coloured pellets (usually blue) may deter the former so if you use molluscicides avoid the cheaper, non-coloured formulations. Wildlife may also be harmed by eating the poisoned slugs, although this probably only applies to methiocarb-based pellets. The formulation of slug pellets is very like that for dog food, with added poison, so it is little wonder that they are eaten by creatures other than those at which they are aimed. Indeed, the Ministry of Agriculture once advised the use of carbamate-based slug pellets for the control of small mammals on farms. The majority of poisonings of pets seen by vets are as a consequence of slug pellet use. So the message is use metaldehyde in a real emergency where slugs are devastating a crop and when no alternative system seems to work. Otherwise choose non chemical methods.

[Amberlilly]

No chemicals please

I just don't like the idea of pesticides being on my food, i don't believe there is any nutritional benefits, altho i have heard milk does! Its bound to have some affect on our health.

[hsthst]

Your free Sunday Roast laced with poison.

What evidence do you have for this statement?

This year I had a frog living, no - thriving, in my warm frame that I only saw when I added more slug pellets. It hopped off when I dismantled my warm frame.

I think I've killed more frogs with my lawn mower than with slug pellets...

... or do you want to ban lawn mowers as well?


Please quote evidence if you make wild statements like this.

Basically, if you are not a farmer/smallholder trying to scratch a living selling your produce, your gardening is a hobby. You are indulging in this hobby in an environment that humans have already suffocated, chopped down and tarmaced over. The natural wildlife which has managed to adapt and survive to fit in with "our" world go about their daily business as best they can as we wipe out more and more of the food chain. They don't need the extra hazzard of a tasty free meal laced with poison on top of that.

[blackkitty]

I think like a lot of others I try to grow organically within the limitations of time, cost etc, but also realise that there are a lot of other factors involved in eating and growing responsibly. I don't use slug pellets because of our frog, toad and newt population and I don't spray with anything other than soap. I buy organic seeds for vegetables where one seed produces a reasonable amount of produce such as courgettes and beans but buy lidl seeds for radishes and lettuce where a certain amount get slugged or bolt quickly. WE use our own compost and manure from a local farm, its non organic but we simply couldn't afford organic fro the lottie.
I buy fairtrade or organic most of the time but would rather buy non organic apples from our local market than organic ones from New Zealand. I buy organic chicken and meat if I buy at the supermarket but don't worry at the butcher as he can tell me exactly where it comes from and the rearing conditions and its all local.

[teakdesk]

Basically, if you are not a farmer/smallholder trying to scratch a living selling your produce, your gardening is a hobby. You are indulging in this hobby in an environment that humans have already suffocated, chopped down and tarmaced over. The natural wildlife which has managed to adapt and survive to fit in with "our" world go about their daily business as best they can as we wipe out more and more of the food chain. They don't need the extra hazzard of a tasty free meal laced with poison on top of that.

I've read and re-read this post many times yet I can't understand its meaning.

Basically, if you are not a farmer/smallholder trying to scratch a living selling your produce, your gardening is a hobby.

I don't grow food to sell, I grow it to eat.

It's not a hobby, I live off the food.

You are indulging in this hobby in an environment that humans have already suffocated, chopped down and tarmaced over.

I'm not indulging a hobby, I'm growing food to live on; food that nourishes me and my family.

I've inspected my garden yet again this morning and can find no evedence of anything suffocated or tarmacced over.

I did have the tops chopped off some overgrown leylandii at the weekend but, I'm sorry, I don't class reducing the size of leylandii as an indulgence.

The natural wildlife which has managed to adapt and survive to fit in with "our" world go about their daily business as best they can as we wipe out more and more of the food chain.

I've walked around my garden and tried to see where I am wiping out more and more of this food chain.

I haven't found any evidence of a food chain being wiped out.

I have found a thriving colony of insects, amphibians, birds, slugs, snails, etc living in my garden. The large twin-bowled wildlife pond is teeming with wildlife of all types.

I wonder what I am doing to wipe out this food chain?

They don't need the extra hazzard of a tasty free meal laced with poison on top of that.

This completely ignores my statement that I have a frog living quite happily in my warm frame that I lace with slug pellets.

It is proof that I am not killing frogs by using slug pellets.






As I said, I have killed frogs with my lawnmower.

Yet again someone makes a wild claim about slug pellets damaging wildlife other than slugs and snails.

Yet they do not know how I use them or what precautions I use.

And yet again they offer no proof to support their wild claims.


I KNOW I have killed frogs with my lawnmower so I demand that lawnmowers are banned because frogs don't need the extra hazard of being chopped to death.





EDIT: I've just realised what wildlife I have wiped out.

I've deliberately and wantonly poisoned two colonies of rats that were living on my land.

One colony was living harmlessly in my compost "dalek" and I destroyed it - including all the sweet little babies.

The other was living in my garage and feeding on my apple windfalls. Even though it was warm and secure in my garage I callously eliminated the whole colony from the earth.

I'm not sure where rats fit into the food chain, but yes, I have wiped them out.

Sorry, I'll go and put on my sack-cloth and start the flagellation.



Double edit: when you say "as we wipe out more and more of the food chain" do you mean the caterpillar eggs I remove from the leaves of my cabbages ?

I'd forgotten about those.

Guilty as charged!



There will probably be other things I'll remember later.

Sorry....

[pdblake]

It's maddening isn't it????

Tell me about it. I've had to make a load of chutney already.

[Mi Jardín]

Probably a bit of all of them to be honest, but I haven't voted as I'm not completely organic. I used a few slug pellets back in the spring, and I did a quick spray tonight because otherwise I wont have anything left because of those darned cabbage whites! I always squish the eggs, but I can't seem to keep on top of them at the moment!

[gojiberry]

And so the debate rages on, and I'm sure it will do for years to come. I do however think that generally we are progressing in the right direction and that as responsible human beings we are starting to think about what we use in the process of growing food. In some instances it has been down to government intervention by withdrawing the use of chemicals but in many instances it has been down to personal choice. When I first started growing vegetables I used chemicals extensively and never gave it a thought, this year I have not sprayed anything although I have used slug pellets and will continue to do so for the time being. I have also used weed killer but not near the veg growing area. So I am not organic and don't think I ever will be, but compared to the way I grew in the 60's I think I have come a long way. To the younger generation it may not be far enough, but then some attitudes take generations to change. On my site of lotties I am one of the youngest (even at 63) and that none of the other plot holders think twice about reaching for the spray gun so the message about organic growing has not reached everyone.

Ian