A raised bed newbie!

[Racheleonie]

Hello all!

I just wondered whether anyone could offer any advice re raised beds.

I'm a first time veg grower this year and thoroughly enjoying growing tumbling toms, six varieties of pepper/chilli and courgettes, with carrots, beans, cabbage and purple sprouting broccoli still intended to come.

Most things will end up in containers or, for the carrots, those canvas root veg grow bags. It seems, however, that for the broccoli and cabbage a bed might be best, and for this I feel a raised bed would be most appropriate given the space available. I have room for a bed of 2ft x 7ft (the size of the concrete slabs it would go on top of that break up our lawn). We live in rented accommodation so building on the concrete slabs would mean we wouldn't have to kill the grass!

Can anyone advise as to a) what steps I would need to make the bed suitable for concrete? b) how to deep it would need to be (the man in the local garden shop makes his at least 1ft) c) what materials (I have a pair of old fence panels measuring 1.83m x 1.5m, would they do or would it need to be thicker)? d) Any general tips on how to construct them! And any tips on keeping our cat form using it as a giant litter tray?! Maybe netting?

Phew! Many thanks and look forward to any replies =)
All best wishes,

Rachel

[Samurailord]

I'm a first time veg grower this year and thoroughly enjoying growing tumbling toms, six varieties of pepper/chilli and courgettes, with carrots, beans, cabbage and purple sprouting broccoli still intended to come.

Quite a haul for a first time grower!

I have room for a bed of 2ft x 7ft (the size of the concrete slabs it would go on top of that break up our lawn). We live in rented accommodation so building on the concrete slabs would mean we wouldn't have to kill the grass!

Not quite sure I understand you here - are you wanting to build on concrete so you don't kill the grass, or are you not bothered about the grass? Personally I wouldn't bas the bed with concrete if you didn't have to, I would cover the grass with a layer of cardboard and then fill the bed with a mix of compost, good top soil, well rotted manure and soil improver.

how to deep it would need to be (the man in the local garden shop makes his at least 1ft) c) what materials (I have a pair of old fence panels measuring 1.83m x 1.5m, would they do or would it need to be thicker)?

The depth really depends on what you are wanting to grow, root crops will need at least 8 - 12 inches but shallow rooting salad leaves wont need much more than 4 - 6 inches.

I wouldn't use fence panels (I presume you are talking about waney lap?) but would look for something more substantial like decking boards.

d) Any general tips on how to construct them!

Hammer a 1" square stake into the ground at each corner and one in the middle of each of the long sides and then fasten your boards to them using screws or nails to make a sturdy structure. Also, 2' wide is quite narrow, try for 4' wide if you can.

And any tips on keeping our cat form using it as a giant litter tray?! Maybe netting?

Netting is good, or is you can get hold of a currry plant or two from your local garden centre these are supposed to keep cats away, but i haven't tried it myself

Andy

[kathyd]

Our raised beds have about 10" soil I think, and happily managed with brassicas last year. But you do need to firm the soil around them quite firmly, which I failed to do, or they'll all fall over . Not sure about drainage if you build on concrete?

[out in the cold]

Welcome to the forum.

You have a great start for a first timer. Well done.

Can I also query using a concrete base? Apart from drainage issues in wet weather, another possible drawback is that this would make them permanent. Whilst you might think that your layout is precisely what you want, if you change your mind afterwards, you will ne stuck with what you lay down.

We are in our second season and thought we had the layout we wanted. Second thoughts and all that. We moved the two beds by six inches during the winter and managed to site another bed between them and plan to move them again next winter to get another two in, so instead of 2, beds plus a big U shaped effort, we will have 5 plus a bigger U shaped thing.

This wouldn't have been possible if we had concreted them.

[Tripmeup]

Didn't the op say she is in rented accommodation and can't ruin the grass???

[veggiechicken]

As I understand it, Rachel wants to put the beds on the concrete as she doesn't want to damage the grass since its a rented property. It sounds like the 2x7 may be a path.
My reservation is that 2' wide is just about right for a brassica but you wouldn't get very many in a 7' bed. It could be a lot of effort and expense for maybe 4 plants.

[Feral007]

I must plant closer than all you people because I"m thinking you'd get quite a few in. We don't plant in rows here, we plant in groups, so a few of everything. You can put the root veg between the brass' and other leafies as one goes down and the others go up.
Then add some flowers to confuse the pests looking, and some garlic and onions to confuse them by smell.

Since you need to plant on the concrete, I'd put very thick cardboard down and then start putting the bed and soil on that. A couple of layers of cardboard should intervene to some extent in the concrete coming thru to the soil, at least for the first year. If it's removable beds that you need someone here or at the hardware store should be able to tell you what you can use for corners so that you can dismantle them if and when you need to. I love going to the hardware store and torturing those poor people with questions like that.

As for the cat! Bluddy animals! Can't have indoor plants here - there's no overwintering in my house!

In the garden beds, if there is freshly dug dirt, all soft and fluffy, you'll find they can't resist.
We tend to use a lot of hay as a mulch and so the dirt is not so visible, or easily got at. You could also put wet newspaper on top of the soil and then just break the paper a little to put your seeds or seedling in. And then put a little mulch of whatever sort your garden shop sells in bags, on it. Cats love an easy hole to dig.

Once things are growing I don't find the cats interested at all. There are sprays and plants called P off. But I've not found them very effective. I've heard they hate the sound/feel of foil. So indoors I put it on flat surfaces if I NEED to keep them off something. You could put a couple of strips of foil across the top of the bed at first (over the paper/mulch) just as an added deterent. If you have a cat like our Evil Kitty, there's no stopping them. Well no legal way anyway

[kathyd]

As I understand it, Rachel wants to put the beds on the concrete as she doesn't want to damage the grass since its a rented property. It sounds like the 2x7 may be a path.
My reservation is that 2' wide is just about right for a brassica but you wouldn't get very many in a 7' bed. It could be a lot of effort and expense for maybe 4 plants.

2' isn't very wide no, but I usually get 3 brassicas across the width of my 1.2m bed - as Feral says, can be a bit squashed up, but it depends what you grow I guess - I wouldn't put 2 sprouts side by side in a 2' bed, but some of my sprouting broccoli would be OK, or cabbages, or khol rabi...

Re-cats, I use debris netting over my brassica beds to ward off pests, which includes the cats! No good for things that need pollinating though, obviously.

[Two_Sheds]

We live in rented accommodation so building on the concrete slabs would mean we wouldn't have to kill the grass!

Veg beds, well made & beautiful, would actually enhance the property, more so than a lawn. "'A well-tended vegetable garden can certainly add to the asking price of your property,' says Cate Dodkin, from estage agent Foxtons. 'It can also widen the market for your home.'

Read more: Veg out: Enjoy home-grown produce and boost your house's value | Mail Online



Or you could always remove them and re-seed the lawn when you leave, if that's what your landlord prefers

[Racheleonie]

Hello everyone,

Thank you so much for all the uber kind and helpful replies! What a wonderful community this is!

There's a lot of great information to take in there - but one theme seems to be a general advising against building on concrete slabs. Sorry for not being clearer in my original message, but yes, my initial thought was to try and avoid building a bed on the grass. Given the responses, I've decided to give texting our landlords a go and to ask if we could build the raised bed on a patch of lawn.

Before I do, however, I just wondered if there were any thoughts on what sort of size would be optimum? More specifically, what would be the minimum dimensions for planting a meaningful number (eg at least 3 of each) of savoy cabbage and purple sprouting broccoli? I was thinking maybe 4ft across and then maybe 7-8ft down... However, according to the packet for the savoy cabbage, the plants need to be 2ft apart, so taking into account the space between plant and edge that means I would only be able to get 1 cabbage in a 4ft row! From more experienced growers, does this sounds about right, or could I squeeze in one or two more? How would you space it length- and width-wise?

As VeggieChicken pointed out, it begins to raise the question as to whether or not I might be just better off sticking with the container plants this year (with which I'd still be delighted!)

Look forward to hearing,
Many thanks and all best wishes to you all,

Rachel

[Rosee]

If the landlord says no to digging up some grass could you maybe build it and put it on legs or something to keep it off the concrete then you could drill holes into the base to help with drainage?

[Indigo23]

Have you thought of checking your lease agreement to see if it specifically states no changes to the garden? If it doesn't, then I would say go ahead and make it the way you want.