All year Alliums Challenge 2016/17

[veggiechicken]

Elephant garlic advice please!
All my plants are bolting and I don't know whether to cut off the scapes or leave them. I assume they form bulbils, like Babington leeks.

To increase the number of plants, is it better to:-
Grow some from bulbils
Split the cloves and grow them
Cut the garlic off and leave the root plate to regrow,

Is the gariic usable after its flowered?
When do you harvest it anyway?

So many questions

[Jay-ell]

VC - so are mine - isn't it wonderful.

Last year mine formed flowers, but I don't know if the seeds are viable.

You can shave the flowers (i.e. cut each little flower off) and then it will form bulbils. These bulbils can be grown on but won't split in the first year, instead they will form a single mono bulb which, when grown on the next year should then split. If you let it flower and shave it then it may not be until late summer/autumn that the bulbils are ready.

I did have one that produced bulbils naturally although I think this was as a response to stress (it also didn't grow vary tall). This year it seems fine and is only just putting up a scape now.

The scapes can be cut off and are delicious stir fried. This will mean that all the energy is put back into the bulb. You could harvest most of the scapes leaving one or two to shave if you wanted.

The bulb should give about 4 large cloves (each one about the size of an average garlic head) which, if planted in autumn, will grow and split again next year.

At the bottom of each bulb (including the mono bulbs) there can be several small corm like bulblets, sometimes formed under the skin, sometimes dangling down from the base of the bulb. These will grow in a similar manner to the bulbils from a top set. Plant these straight away as once dried they can go dormant for a couple of years.

The ones hanging off the roots have a tendency to drop off into the soil when you dig up the bulb. I dug up around 30 rogue plants this year from the spot I planted last year and the year before. Each plant can produce several of these so, although it takes an extra year it's a great way to build up stock (from my original 6 cloves 2 years ago I have about 30 plants in the ground now + 30 rogues)

The one I dug up today wasn't there last time I was down (Wednesday) and came from last years harvest. The ones I dug up previous to that were from the previous years patch. Dug up young they haven't produced corms and can be transplanted to pots or a safe patch.

Plants can flower in their first year from a corm, but I don't think this is usual. A corm I grew and transplanted last year flowered, was shaved, grew bulbils, died down and regrew this year. It is now sending up a second flower stalk. I have to make a decision as to whether I let it flower then see what the bulb is like or have it put all it's energy into the bulb. The bulbils I planted last year don't seem to look as if they are bolting (yet).

The flower stalk comes from the centre of the old bulb with the new bulbs forming around it, just like hardneck garlic. The cloves are fine. I think all my elephants bolted last year and I'm still eating the cloves (down to single figures now).

The bulb is like a big garlic bulb so the root plate is divided between each of the cloves in the same way. Cutting the root plate off will cut into the cloves and they wont store.

You might find that when you lift them the cloves have started to separate rather than keeping a tight head - mine done that last year, I think I should have lifted them earlier. As I said, I've still got cloves now that are fine.

Now it's just a case of waiting for the leaves to die back half way ish then dig up.

[Jay-ell]

Oh yes, remember this
http://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gra...ml#post1486543

[Jay-ell]

Today more elephant garlic scapes, some garlic rounds from the Autumn planted Spring split Marco and regular bulbs from the Autumn split Marco.

The last harvest from the Three Cornered leeks was today as well. I pulled off the seed pods, cut back the dying and dried foliage and rooted up the bulbs. So after about 6 months of harvesting leaf, flower stalks, flower heads, pulling up entire plants and now the seed heads (all of which were delicious) I have a 500% increase in the number of bulbs.

Not all of the bulbs are going to be replanted - they have a wonderful crunch and a sweet, very mild onion flavour. Still, I am going to need more planters next year as I now know more about what I'm doing with them.

[veggiechicken]

Let the Alliums decide!

I have a leftover allium bed, contained various garlic, shallot and onion sets/cloves that were left from my cheapo end of season purchases a few months ago.
Today, I added some Red Baron onion sets and 12 pots of various bunching onions -Ishikuro, Kyoto, Winter White and some unnamed spring onions.

I have a cunning plan for this bed

The alliums will decide their own future!
If they grow big and strong I will eat them.
If they are puny little things they can live on for another year or die. Their choice!
If they bolt, they can stay put and set seed which can sow itself wherever it chooses.
If they choose to cross pollinate, I hope they will be very happy together, whatever their children look like!

I'm not going to interfere apart from the occasional nibbling and weeding.
Ask me for an update next year

[Jay-ell]

Is that really a new idea? I thought that was the way you grow anyway.

Had a poke around the base of the Allium Polyanthum leeks today and they have nice big fat bulbs (except fot the ones I ate, their bulbs are smaller) so they may have a secondary harvest along the lines of elephant garlic - wont be able to find out until I have enough to eat as I only have 5 at the moment and I'm hoping the bulbs will split in a similar way to provide more plants. Have you ever been impatient for your plants to die off?

The Mouse Garlic seemed to just hang in there but recently it seems to have perked up and looks like it might be doing something - it doesn't look as it it's trying to flower yet just putting up nice green leaves.

The hookers chives are doing OK as well with not flowers in sight yet. Nice sweet taste with a stronger oniony afterbite.

Also poked around the Oerprei a little. Although the mother ball was nice and round I couldn't see any more broodballs - of course if the Babington Bulbil plants and the Elephant Garlic is anything to go by they could be dangling ont he bottom of the mother.

I've got 6 pots planted up with the corms from the Elephant Garlic Bulbil plants. 5 corms in five of them 7 in the other. The corms were put into the pots almost straight away so I should be able to see how quickly they germinate for next year. I've some corms from the mature bulbs I harvested the other week which I'm letting dry off first and I'll do the same in the autumn to see if the strike rate differs. Before planting them I pinched off a little of the outer coating to allow moisture in.

[veggiechicken]

Its a newish idea for ordinary onions and garlic as they're usually lifted in summer and the bed cleared. I'm giving this bed over permanently to alliums (and a mulberry tree and some self seeded chard and asparagus kale and some volunteer spuds)..............but you get the idea
My adventures in Allium land are not half as exciting as yours!

[Cadalot]

Cadalot's All Year Alliums Update

My everlasting onions sent to me by a fellow grape grew and then died over winter!

My bed of 105 over wintered Japanese and Radar Onions have white rot, and those that have survived have been harvested early and are in the drying rack extension to the shed



So far only one of my Air Onions has developed bulbs at the top of the stem



Where as the Catawissa Walking Onions appear to have gone to seed off onions that are at the top of the stem and are sprouting off again.



The regrow spring onions from a root cutting of shop bought onions experiment is providing interesting results



I still have half a bed of Red Onions that appear at the moment to be holding their own against the white rot and spring onions



Now with white rot on both allotment plots, do I actually have a chance of growing all year alliums?

I'm now thinking about growing in compost in pots or containers rather than the plots soil, but what minimum depth of container could I get away with?

[Jay-ell]

I hate white rot - the jungle plot is riddled with it. I'm trying the garlic powder treatment for the next couple of years to see if that works. I've a few walking onions, multiplier onions and potato onions in pots on that plot. Hoping that the New Territories is clear.

Air Onions - are these a Finnish Variety?

One of my McCullar Onions is also onto the second tier of flowers, although more creeping onions than walking onions as I had to transplant them out of the greenhouse and they sprawled.

[Cadalot]

Yep My Walking Onions are Catawissa which originated from the USA and Air Onions that came from Finland. Take a look at the post at Alans Allotment: Top, Topset, Top Setting, Air, Tree or Egyptian Walking Onions

As a thank you for my blog about him, Ian has informed me that If you let him know that you found him via me Quote "Cadalot" and you order directly from his web site, he will send you 20% more onions than you ordered.

[Jay-ell]

Nice link Cadders - especially for the Air Onion - I may have to get some of those.

I have McCullar Whites which make lots of small bulbils - bit of a faf to prepare to eat but they make great sets for spring onions. One (2nd generation) has a two tier bulb and one of the first has a flower head waiting to burst open. Hoping more will kick out they loads soon.

My Red Walking onions are just about to open the flowers. Pity I only have 2 bulbs of these, but they soon split and multiply.

In pots I have the bulbils growing away for Catawissa, Amish and Moritz.

[Jay-ell]

FYI These are the seeds of the Three Cornered Leek.

The black bits are the actual seeds.
The Brownish bits are a type of oil which ants like. They carry the seed off and strip it of the oil, discarding the seeds onto their midden pile along with all the waste matter from the hill - giving them a great pile of fertiliser to help them on their way.

Each bulb can put up more than one flower stalk.
Each flower stalk has a group or around 10 flowers, each flower produces 6 seeds.
Each seed that grows can split into 5 bulbs by the end of the year.

[Cadalot]

Jay it looks like my Catawissa are trying to do the two tier bulb thing as at the head one of the bulbs appear to have sprouted and has continued upwards. Either that or they are going to seed !

[Jay-ell]

Here's one of the MacCullers with flowers and bulbils :-


And Another one with the double decker flowers


Plus the Red walking Onion with flowers and bulbils

[Jay-ell]

And Some other alliums that are flowering on the plot at the moment.

The Sand Leek, you can see the bulbils forming on the bottom of the flower head. The bulbs are the same rich purple colour.


Golden Garlic, AKA Moly, is an unusual yellow flowering allium


Corw Garlic is another bulbil forming allium - this is a variety called Hair