green manure - Phacelia vs Vicia

[queen of the cobs]

Dear All,

I am thinking of growing a green manure on 2 beds which I have just harvested. Do I leave it to grow over the winter? And do I dig the whole plant 'in' in the spring? Or do I dig in at the end of the summer?

I was thinking of sowing some Phacelia as they have rather nice blue flowers, I think? As I have 2 beds, I guess I could try 2 different sorts. I'd love your advice - it's always so helpful.

[oneflewover]

Not a reply as such, but I have just sown 2x beds of fenugreek and one of buckwheat today and will be monitoring both your and mines progress

[oneflewover]

Just a little update, the seed is germinating so looks like they could be as quick growers as advertised.

[Heidi]

My husband planted out some alfalfa seed yesterday on our spare bed - so any advice on when to dig it in would be greatly appriecated!

[Two_Sheds]

There's conflicting advice on how to deal with green manures, ie digging in or not. I am of the opinion (and someone on Gardeners Question Time confirmed this) that worms prefer their food left on the surface of the soil, not dug in. Also, if you bury the stuff, nitrogen in the soil is used up to decompose it. This has prob.raised more questions than it answers, so you may want to use Google now!

Also, the plant has more goodness in it BEFORE it flowers, so don't let it all flower....just one or two for the bees and/or seeds.

Me, I grow alfalfa, crimson clover (both legumes, so keep with peas/beans in your rotation plan), mustard (brassica) and grazing rye & limnanthes (not part of a rotation, so can be used anywhere). I sow as and when I have a spare patch, and cut-and-come-again it, leaving the cuttings on the surface for the worms to drag down. If I have a whole lot at once, I will cut it and put in Dalek composter.

[Sebbster]

TS, which green manures can be sown now ? I have some spare space which probably now wont get used this year and would like to put some down, but I dont know much on the subject...

[Cutecumber]

Rye grass - Italian rye grass or grazing rye - can be sown now and will give good cover through the winter. The problem I found was keeping things from digging in the newly sown soil, so bear that in mind - it left it a bit patchy, but growth was strong. It's cheap and easy, I would say. Worth a try.

Field beans (a type of broad bean) can be sown now too - they will fix some nitrogen. I haven't tried these myself. Factor these into your rotation.

[Sebbster]

OK Thanks, I'll take a look at Rye...

[broadway]

Another Question On Green Manure

I'm in the process of digging 5x1 metre square beds to start using next year.

As I plan to fill each bed with a mixture of compost and soil my question is when do I plant the green manure, before of after the compost goes in?

Out of interest the GM I've got is mustard and field beans, any comments?

Thanks

[Cutecumber]

Broadway - that's a good question!

Both the compost and the green manure are used for similar purposes (if you dig the green manure into the soil) so you might say one or the other rather than both. I am tempted to say sow the green manure, dig it in at the end of the winter, and add more compost at that point. Left covered, for the green manure to rot down and the soil to warm up, your bed should be ready for a spring sowing or planting.

I think that's the way I would do it - I am talking theory here rather than experience!!

Remember that mustard is a brassica and the beans are a legume - again, look at a rotation pattern and see where these would fit in. Either are suitable for over-wintering, but you don't want to build up diseases for a similar following crop.

[Hazel at the Hill]

Without wishing to hijack the thread (but i'm going to anyway...) I've just ordered some hungarian rye for green manure from the organic catalogue.

They did loads of different ones which boggled the ol' grey matter somewhat, but I decided on the rye as it can be sown as late as October and it was the cheapest of the lot!

So can any of you clever grapes tell me how long it will take from digging it in to when I can sow/plant out? I've read (somewhere) two weeks, but that sounds like not very long at all?

[broadway]

Thanks Hazel,

I think I'll sow the green manure, dig it in at the end of the winter, and add more compost at that point.

When you say leave covered are you suggesting coving the compost and GM with something, for instance carpet, cardboard etc?

Many thanks.........Danny

[broadway]

Sorry last thanks should have been for Cutecumber!!

Sorry last thanks should have been for Cutecumber!!