Holes in my Brussels and Liquid Derris!

[nooby]

Hi all...

The title says it all.

I went to do some watering yesterday and my Brussels have holes in all of them. There are 2 that have been pretty devoured, including the heart. See pic below... I had a look and only found one little caterpillar, the rest are obviously having a nap somewhere with a full belly! I sprayed them well with Bug Clear fruit and veg as its all I had and also there are billions of white fly all over them too. I dont think this controls them though.

Will they survive this attack? The plants are easily 3-3.5ft and have little buttons on. The interesting thing is that I just made some wood cages and covered with debris netting. I previously had just canes and netting... 2 Saturdays ago, I built the new cages and whilst I was stapling the debris netting to the frames 2 cabbage whites got in before I finished, I had to shoo them out. Could the little blighters have of laid eggs in a few minutes??

There is also some holes in my Cavolo Nero next to them, also in a wooden cage.

Any advice???



On to the second part of my title... The shed that I inherited on the allotment has bottles and bottles of liquid Derris and also a good few pots of Bordeaux mixture (see pics). I know these are both banned but are they banned worldwide? Does anyone on here still use Derris?

I have to admit I was seriously thinking about it yesterday when I saw the state of my previously flawless sprouts! The only reason I even got an allotment was so I could grow sprouts for my Xmas table!

The only thing stopping me is I have a 5 year old and am concerned about the dangers, the fact is I don't know how old it is (cant seem to see an expiry on there) and I am no expert so not sure if it is genuine Derris in the bottle, it smells a bit like kaolin and morphine or one of those old school chalky medicines.



Anyhoo, any advice on all or some of the above would be great.

[veggiechicken]

Re the chemicals, I wouldn't use them. Derris was banned in 2008 so yours are at least 10 years old. I'm sure there were valid reasons for banning them so I wouldn't use them if they were mine. They should be disposed of responsibly too.

[veggiechicken]

Re the chemicals, I wouldn't use them. Derris was banned in 2008 so yours are at least 10 years old. I'm sure there were valid reasons for banning them so I wouldn't use them if they were mine. They should be disposed of responsibly too.

https://www.rhs.org.uk/advice/profile?pid=820

[nooby]

Thank You for the advice and link!

I will of course dispose of them properly.

[nooby]

Just a bump on this with regards to the Brussel Damage.

I have at least 3-4 plants out of 10 that have hundreds of holes and the main heart has been munched... See pic. I have still only found 1 caterpillar but it seems as though something is still eating them.

There are lots of little black aphids on the stems but I cant be sure if they are all aphids or Caterpillar poo!?

Can I do anything to halt the attack bearing in mind I cant find any caterpillars, just lots of little black bugs (or poop) and millions of whitefly.

Will they still grow after such an attack?

Many Thanks

[nickdub]

definitely caterpillar damage - whether they are still there is impossible to say of course - I've used lots of different sprays to kill them over the years, most of which are illegal now.

The single most effective easily obtainable one is nicotine solution, made by boiling up fag ends - it is extremely poisonous and also probably against the law too.

[Jungle Jane]

Sprouts will still grow,the caterpillars seem to eat all the leaves before the sprouts,sometimes they’re cocooned in webbing in leaf edges ready for their next growth stage. I usually find a couple in the brussel tops,you can squirt a jet sprayer of water to dislodge them so you don’t damage the tiny leaves,I put a bit of garlic & dot of hand soap in too.

[Jungle Jane]

definitely caterpillar damage - whether they are still there is impossible to say of course - I've used lots of different sprays to kill them over the years, most of which are illegal now.

The single most effective easily obtainable one is nicotine solution, made by boiling up fag ends - it is extremely poisonous and also probably against the law too.

Boiling cigarette ends sounds toxic,go for natural ingredients if you can,they’ll come back again anyway it’s a repetitive problem with exposed brassicas.

[Snoop Puss]

Looks to me a bit like damage caused by this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabbage_looper

They are quite difficult to spot. They often spend the night along the length of a central rib of a leaf and are surprisingly good at not moving. Very satisfying to squish...

[nickdub]

Boiling cigarette ends sounds toxic,go for natural ingredients if you can,they’ll come back again anyway it’s a repetitive problem with exposed brassicas.

As I said nicotine solution is extremely poisonous ; just a small amount will kill you if you drink it - it is however 100% natural if made from pure tobacco, which goes to show that not all natural, organic substances are harmless or good for you.

[nooby]

Sprouts will still grow,the caterpillars seem to eat all the leaves before the sprouts,sometimes they’re cocooned in webbing in leaf edges ready for their next growth stage. I usually find a couple in the brussel tops,you can squirt a jet sprayer of water to dislodge them so you don’t damage the tiny leaves,I put a bit of garlic & dot of hand soap in too.

Thats great news. I thought if the tops were damaged then they were doomed. They have ravaged pretty much all the tops.